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Ospreys Over Afghanistan

October 26, 2009: For the first time. a U.S. Marine Corps MV-22 Ospreys tilt-rotor squadron (10-12 aircraft) will arrive in Afghanistan by the end of the year. Three of these squadrons have already served in Iraq (one after another.) Earlier this year, the first MV-22 squadron was based on an amphibious ship. VMM-263 is shipping out, with ten MV-22s, on the 41,000 ton LHD USS Bataan.

The marines began using the MV-22 in Iraq in late 2007, and have been satisfied with the results. The only major problems were engine durability. That's a common problem in the "sand box." Every other vehicle that uses a gas turbine engine in Iraq (from M-1 tanks to C-17 jet transports) have reported increased wear on their engines because of the copious and continuous dust and sand in Iraq.

Another problem was that even frequent inspections won't always catch an engine that's about to die from too much dust and sand. Several MV-22s in western Iraq (Anbar province, where marine MV-22s were operating) experienced engine failures. There have been no crashes, but there have been emergency landings (followed by quick engine changes so the $70 million, 20 ton aircraft could get home under its own power). The Rolls Royce T-406 engines weigh about a ton each, and put out 6,000 horsepower. Marine maintenance crews are trained to put a spare engine inside a V-22, along with needed tools, fly out to where another V-22 has made an emergency landing, do the engine change quickly, and get back to base in one piece.

The MV-22s sent to Iraq moved there by ship. They could have flown themselves, but that would have meant organizing aerial tankers, and dealing with possible icing problems over the North Atlantic. Plus it would have put more wear and tear on the aircraft. Shipping out with the USS Wasp will expose the aircraft to more saltwater exposure (which, so far, has not been a problem), and ample opportunity to operate over water. The Wasp also has CH-53E, AH-1Z and UH-1N helicopters on board, plus some AV-8B jets.  

The MV-22s used by the marines can carry 24 troops 700 kilometers (vertical take-off on a ship, level flight, landing, and return) at 390 kilometers an hour. The V-22 is replacing the CH-46E helicopter, which can carry 12 troops 350 kilometers at a speed of 135 kilometers an hour. The V-22 can carry a 10,000-pound external sling load 135 kilometers, while the CH-46E can carry 3,000 pounds only 90 kilometers.

 

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itfin    Osprey gunship?   10/26/2009 9:50:18 PM
 
does anyone know why the Marines don't attempt to convert an Osprey into a gunship?  It would seem to be ideal craft (vertical takeoff, flies like a plane) and Afghanistan seems the ideal place to use gunships.  Just curious to see what others think of this idea.
 
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Ringo       10/26/2009 11:04:39 PM
Well, the Osprey isn't a particularly spacious vehicle.  In my opinion, an Osprey gunship would just be a tiny, expensive waste of money that could be spent on REAL gunships that would be useful.  It would kind of fill a niche that doesn't exist if you would. 
 
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ArtyEngineer       10/26/2009 11:13:58 PM

 

does anyone know why the Marines don't attempt to convert an Osprey into a gunship?  It would seem to be ideal craft (vertical takeoff, flies like a plane) and Afghanistan seems the ideal place to use gunships.  Just curious to see what others think of this idea.



Bottom line is you cant hang ordnance from the wings as there is only a few inches clearance betewwn the rotors and the fueselage when in aircraft mode.  There was a concept demonstrator with a chin turret but it never went beyond that.  The V-22 will however be recieving the BAE remote guardian weapon station which protruded from the belly but thats is purely a defensive weapon and for use in the supression of a "warm/hot" lz during insertion.  The platform just doesnt suit itself to a "gunship" type role
 
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Mike From Brielle    If I were    10/27/2009 10:32:37 AM
to try and create a tilt rotor gunship I'd probably try to base it on the OV-10 not the V-22.  I'd keep the engines where they are and put the rotors at the wing tips of course.  However I was thinking it might be possible to make it so you extend the wing out a little and keep the rotors so that they not extend any further than where the engine nacelles are.  I would take the present three bladed rotor and change it to a eight bladed thin blades in two sets of four on the same axial drive shaft one set in front of the other.  With the blades pointed forward for level flight the blades would be equidistantly spaced at 45 degrees.  Maximum efficiency for level flight.   For vertical flight the bottom set of blades would advance a bit until they were just behind the upper set of blades than they would increase their pitch until they together with the parasitic turbulence of the upper set of blades (and maybe some over the wing surface blowing action) form effectively four very large cord blades.  Maximum efficiency for vertical and/or hovering.  Like the old OV-10 this would allow for some area inside the engine nacelles which would allow for forward firing ordinance.  I'd like allot of armor so I'd use the same engines as the Osprey if you could get them onto a airframe the size of the Bronco and you didn't overload the blade disk.  Its a trade off like everything else.
 
Disclaimer:  I am not an aeronautical engineer (I'm electrical with some background with both fixed wing and rotary aircraft) so I'm perfectly willing to admit I may be talking out of my @$$ but anyhow its just a thought.
 
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phrogdriver       11/19/2009 8:44:20 PM
No offense, but that is a completely Rube Goldberg crackpot concept.  Any number of ways would get you a VSTOL armed aircraft more easily, from a compound helicopter, to VSTOL jets, to a tiltrotor.  Any of those could put warheads on foreheads more easily than developing a weird new type of aircraft out of a Bronco.
 
 
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