NEW: Follow the Editorial Staff on
StrategyPage Twitter Link


GROUND COMBAT +

AIR COMBAT +

NAVAL OPERATIONS +

SPECIAL OPERATIONS +

HUMAN FACTORS +

SPECIAL WEAPONS +

WARFARE BY THE NUMBERS +

LOGISTICS +

TOOLS +


Visit StrategyPage's US Cavalry Store



Naval Air Article Index : Current 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009
 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics

Chinese Carrier Goes Into Dry Dock

April 30, 2009: China has moved its aircraft carrier, the Shi Lang, into dry dock, apparently to install engines and other heavy equipment. A year ago, the Russian aircraft carrier Varyag was renamed the Shi Lang (after the Chinese general who took possession of Taiwan in 1681, the first time China ever paid any attention to the island) and given the pennant number 83. The Chinese have been refurbishing the Varyag, one of the Kuznetsov class that Russia began building in the 1980s, for five years now. It is expected to be ready for sea trials by the end of the year. Maybe. No one is sure exactly what plans the Chinese have for the Shi Lang, although work has been going on for years, and it's believed that the carrier will eventually be used to train the first generation of Chinese carrier aviators and sailors.

The Varyag has been tied up in a Chinese shipyard at Dailan since 2002. While the ship is under guard, it can be seen from a nearby highway. From that vantage point, local military and naval buffs have noted that some kind of work is being done on the ship. The only visible signs of this work are a new paint job (in the gray shade used by the Chinese navy) and ongoing work on the superstructure (particularly the tall island on the flight deck.) Many workers can be seen on the ship, and material is seen going into (new stuff) and out of (old stuff) the ship. Shipyard workers report ever tighter security on the carriers, and stern instructions to workers to not report details of what is happening on the carriers.

Originally the Kuznetsovs were to be 90,000 ton, nuclear powered ships, similar to American carriers (complete with steam catapults). Instead, because of the high cost, and the complexity of modern (American style) carriers, the Russians were forced to scale back their plans, and ended up with the 65,000 ton (full load ) ships that lacked steam catapults, and used a ski jump type flight deck instead. Nuclear power was dropped, but the Kuznetsov class was still a formidable design. The thousand foot long carrier normally carries a dozen navalized Su-27s (called Su-33s), 14 Ka-27PL anti-submarine helicopters, two electronic warfare helicopters and two search and rescue helicopters. But the ship can carry up to 36 Su-33s and sixteen helicopters. The ship carries 2,500 tons of aviation fuel, allowing it to generate 500-1,000 aircraft and helicopter sorties. Crew size is 2,500 (or 3,000 with a full aircraft load.) Only two ships of this class exist; the original Kuznetsov, which is in Russian service, and the Varyag. Currently, the Kuznetsov is operating in the Mediterranean.

The Chinese have been in touch with Russian naval construction firms, and may have purchased plans and technology for equipment installed in the Kuznetsov. Some Chinese leaders have quipped about having a carrier by 2010 (this would have to be a refurbished Varyag). Even that would be an ambitious schedule, and the Chinese have been burned before when they tried to build new military technology in a hurry.

Late last year, China announced that its first class of carrier aviators had begun training at the Dalian Naval Academy. The naval officers will undergo a four year course of instruction to turn them into fighter pilots capable of operating off a carrier. China already has an airfield, in the shape of a carrier deck, built at an inland facility. The Russians have warned China that it may take them a decade or more to develop the knowledge and skills needed to efficiently run an aircraft carrier. The Chinese are game, and are slogging forward.

submit to reddit
Send Link to a Friend
Next Article AIR TRANSPORTATION: Russian Wide Body Blues


Email Me When A New Comment Is Made
Show Only Poster Name and Title     Sort in Reverse Order Posted

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5   NEXT
flyingarty    Chineese Carrier   4/30/2009 12:39:34 PM
A Carrier without its support ships is just a big floating target, Fyingarty
 
Quote    Reply

JFKY    UNLESS...   4/30/2009 12:56:50 PM
The CV is flying Rafale, in which case, it is INVINCIBLE!  Nothing will be able to touch it.
 
Quote    Reply

formercccp    big target   4/30/2009 2:52:57 PM
Arty,

China has enough support ships to cover this carrier, mind you not the airplanes for it... :D

Keep in mind that if the Chinese follow the soviet design doctrine on this vessel it will be not an Aircraft carrier but rather a heavy aircraft carrying cruiser (TAVKR). Which in itself for anyone familiar with naval classifications will know that its a different beast all togeither compared to a CV type aircraft carrier of the United States. If I was the chinese I would add a few of these launchers to it too.. link

lets wikipedia it ...

if the chinese copy all the gear then it will be equal if not better to the Kuznetzov which again is not a carrier but a TAVKR

? 8 × AK-630 AA guns (6×30 mm, 6,000 round/min/mount, 24,000 rounds)
? 8 × CADS-N-1 Kashtan CIWS (each 2 × 30 mm Gatling AA plus 16 3K87 Kortik SAM)
? 12 × P-700 Granit SSM
? 18 × 8-cell 3K95 Kinzhal SAM VLS (192 missiles; 1 missile per 3 seconds)
? RBU-12000 UDAV-1 ASW rocket launchers (60 rockets)

vs lets say: USS Ronald Reagan (CVN-76)

2 × Mk 29 Sea Sparrow
2 × RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile 

so of course a CVN needs a ton more of protection and support, its a floating airfield. not to say that a TAVKR doesnt need support ships either. And if a carrier were to operate off chinas coast (say between taiwan and mainland) they will have additional air support from land based aircraft.
---


 
Quote    Reply

formercccp    big target   4/30/2009 3:37:07 PM
Arty,

China has enough support ships to cover this carrier, mind you not the airplanes for it... :D

Keep in mind that if the Chinese follow the soviet design doctrine on this vessel it will be not an Aircraft carrier but rather a heavy aircraft carrying cruiser (TAVKR). Which in itself for anyone familiar with naval classifications will know that its a different beast all togeither compared to a CV type aircraft carrier of the United States. If I was the chinese I would add a few of these launchers to it too.. link

lets wikipedia it ...

if the chinese copy all the gear then it will be equal if not better to the Kuznetzov which again is not a carrier but a TAVKR

? 8 × AK-630 AA guns (6×30 mm, 6,000 round/min/mount, 24,000 rounds)
? 8 × CADS-N-1 Kashtan CIWS (each 2 × 30 mm Gatling AA plus 16 3K87 Kortik SAM)
? 12 × P-700 Granit SSM
? 18 × 8-cell 3K95 Kinzhal SAM VLS (192 missiles; 1 missile per 3 seconds)
? RBU-12000 UDAV-1 ASW rocket launchers (60 rockets)

vs lets say: USS Ronald Reagan (CVN-76)

2 × Mk 29 Sea Sparrow
2 × RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile 

so of course a CVN needs a ton more of protection and support, its a floating airfield. not to say that a TAVKR doesnt need support ships either. And if a carrier were to operate off chinas coast (say between taiwan and mainland) they will have additional air support from land based aircraft.
---


 
Quote    Reply

DarthAmerica       4/30/2009 4:16:14 PM
The Chinese have to get in this game and get their feet wet sooner or later. A look at the Chinese economy and SLOC CLEARLY demonstrates a need to forward deployable PLANAF air power to protect their SLOC and interest abroad. This wont by itself give them any real ability to directly confront a USN CVN. But it would allow the PRC to send forth a very powerful formidable Carrier Task Force relative to neighbors. At first there will be some gaps. Quite obviously this ship doesn't have the capability to sustain the kind of sorties necessary to duplicate the coverage of a USN CVN. It's going to take time for the PLAN to develop a doctrine and CONOPS for carrier operations. They will have to learn how to fight this thing over time. But it will lay the foundation for follow on designs and experienced PLAN naval aviators and ship drivers who can then pass that knowledge down.

Definitely something to monitor out of prudence, but nothing unexpected or to be frightened of.

-DA 
 
Quote    Reply

Nanheyangrouchuan       4/30/2009 7:08:19 PM
The Chinese may try to cut out the bottom and install the engines, then add everything else.  They have the money and the manpower to do it and I wouldn't be surprised if the space between the ship and the dry dock get tarped to limit reconnaissance.
 
The Varyag can operate within the Taiwan Strait, E. China Sea and S. China Sea fairly easily because of cover  from the PLAAF as well as sub and surface support.
 
BTW, the PLAN doctrine of "island chains" and the PLAN's latest naval parade has made it into the newest edition of The Economist.
 
Quote    Reply

DarthAmerica       4/30/2009 7:51:35 PM

The Chinese may try to cut out the bottom and install the engines, then add everything else.  They have the money and the manpower to do it and I wouldn't be surprised if the space between the ship and the dry dock get tarped to limit reconnaissance.
 
The Varyag can operate within the Taiwan Strait, E. China Sea and S. China Sea fairly easily because of cover  from the PLAAF as well as sub and surface support.

BTW, the PLAN doctrine of "island chains" and the PLAN's latest naval parade has made it into the newest edition of The Economist.


The Chinese could not keep the Varyag missile capable longer than a single day if they dare put it in the Taiwan Strait during a conflict. What a waste if they did so. A much better strategy would be to use it along their SLOC as a presence tool of their FP and to develop the skill sets for an expanded Carrier program. There is a lot of talk about what the PRC can throw at Taiwan and very little talk about what Taiwan can throw back. I would not risk my ONLY carrier in that environment. Single digit minute survivability times are a possibility by the time Varyag was operational.

-DA 

 
Quote    Reply

flyingarty    Carrier   5/1/2009 9:05:52 AM
FromerCCCP-well reasoned-especially if your goal is to intimidate your neightbors rather than roam the 7 seas.
 
Frankly if China really , REALLY,  wanted to bug the US , the way to go would be with submarines and missiles. It does not project power like an aircraft carrier task force, but it would create many sleepless night for military planners.
 
Flyingarty
 
 
 
Quote    Reply

Librarian    Think long-term   5/1/2009 7:53:58 PM
Some of the posters are missing the essence of the Chinese naval strategy.  They don't intend or even want to tangle with the USN today, tomorrow or even ten years from now. They are looking decades down the road.  What they are doing is learning about how to build and operate carriers. As they become comfortable with them, then they may well start building them on a larger scale. Navies take a long time to build.  Unless I am very much mistaken, the Chinese are more likely thinking of 2040 than 2010 or 2015.
 
Quote    Reply

JFKY    Librarian   5/1/2009 8:11:22 PM
Well then, I am reminded of the late great economist Keynes' quip, "In the Long Run everyone dies."  As economics goes it's pretty lame, but it encapsulates a bit of truth, nonetheless.  If the Chinese are looking at 2040 they are lunkheads...no one in the PRC power structure is going to be alive in 2040 and I don't think politicians, even Communist ones, are altruistic enough to "gift" their successors.
 
I guess I get a little annoyed at the "The Chinese think long term" idea...well they can if they want, but the how many humans make a 25 year plan that works?
 
A carrier like the Kuznetsov might be first step or all the PRC desires...want a/c at sea, but most of your striking power in missiles, a Kuznetsov might make sense.  Want to hunt pirates  or enforce dominance over the Parcels or Spratlys, it might make sense.  Does the PRC REALLY need CVN's like the Nimitz?  Most of the people they might fight in a big way can be reached by road or short-haul freighter...unlike the US.
 
Quote    Reply

gf0012-aust       5/1/2009 8:48:55 PM
Some of the PLAN CV designs are damn awful.

eg they have one which uses flanking runways to a centre based citadel.  3 lanes a side, and a non engineering vision of being able to ripple volley  6 aircraft at a time.

with designs like  that under consideration or submission, then they've got a long way to go....  too much unbridled russian innovation (so as to not appear western) IMO.  result, unworkable hybrids
 
Quote    Reply

DarthAmerica       5/1/2009 9:57:44 PM

Some of the posters are missing the essence of the Chinese naval strategy.  They don't intend or even want to tangle with the USN today, tomorrow or even ten years from now. They are looking decades down the road.  What they are doing is learning about how to build and operate carriers. As they become comfortable with them, then they may well start building them on a larger scale. Navies take a long time to build.  Unless I am very much mistaken, the Chinese are more likely thinking of 2040 than 2010 or 2015.

No one is missing that. In fact I would hope the PLAN is smart enough to think of that considering how crucial open SLOC are to their existence and the fact that the USN is the principle threat to that. Just like we've been thinking of them for decades and will continue to for decades. But the PRC also has Japan, Russia, Taiwan, Vietnam, Australia, Singapore, India and even Pirates to worry about RIGHT NOW. Considering China's dependence on sea trade, this is not really a very surprising or even remarkable development other than it would be their first CV.

-DA 
 
Quote    Reply

Shawnc    Any comments, GF?   5/4/2009 4:10:05 AM
I recently read a Jamestown Foundation report that China possess 'catapult techniques' - which I always assumed was the one stumbling block for all nations in enabling their aircraft carriers to launch full-loaded warplanes.
 
link
 
Would GF care to comment, or are you too busy rubbing your hands in glee over the 12 new Aussie built subs? ;)

Oh... and the PRC's defense minister pretty much summed it up when he spoke about aircraft carriers from a 'prestige' point of view. It's interesting that the Shi Lang/Varyag gets dry-docked less than a month after his reported comments.  (Oh, and I read somewhere that the ever helpful Ukrainians insisted that ship's plans were purchased at the same time it was sold to that Macau based casino company...)

IMHO, it'll emerge with a self-defense weapons fit and will probably operate more as a trial ship and showboat than anything with major power projection - China pretty much wants to show the flag around it's clientele around Africa, and there's a possibility of a potential carrier arms race with the Indians. Perhaps 12 SU-33MK2s or J-10B and a half-dozen choppers. At least it'll get more use than the Chakri Naruebet...
 
But they're still at least 10-15 years from fielding their own 'Proudly made in the PRC' carriers and air-wings.
 
 
 
Quote    Reply

cwDeici       5/4/2009 10:28:51 AM
I wonder if a tired Obama would intervene if we sicced this on our neighbors in 2015...
 
Quote    Reply

cwDeici       5/4/2009 10:29:35 AM
I mean the islands ye'all mentioned of courrse (and to just scare Taiwan into more compliance), those are the ones we want for now.
 
Quote    Reply
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5   NEXT





New Strategy - Wargames at Discount Prices
1.Modern Air Power: War Over the Middle East
2.Commander: Napoleon at War
3.Close Combat: Watch am Rhein
4.Gallic Wars
5.Fast Action Battle: The Bulge

100+ Computer and Board games all with free shipping.
 
 
 

StrategyWorld.com© 1998 - 2009StrategyWorld.com. All rights Reserved. StrategyWorld.com, StrategyPage.com, FYEO, For Your Eyes Only and Al Nofi's CIC are all trademarks of StrategyWorld.com Privacy Policy