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A Half Century Of Harrier

March 24, 2009: The Harrier vertical take-off fighter-bomber appears to be on its way to being another of those warplanes that will serve for half a century. The Harrier was developed jointly by U.S. and British firms, and first entered service in 1969. That version was used mainly by the British Royal Navy and the U.S. Marine Corps. It was a 11 ton aircraft (7 tons when taking off vertically) that carried about two tons of weapons. In the 1980s, a more powerful 14 ton version was developed, which could carry three tons of weapons.

On the downside, the Harrier has the highest accident rate of any jet fighter. This is largely because of its vertical flight capabilities, which give it an accident rate similar to that of helicopters. In the last twenty years, India has lost half of its 30 Harrier vertical takeoff fighters to accidents, and the fifteen remaining aircraft often cannot fly because of a shortage of spares. The U.S. Marine Corps has lost a third of its 397 Harriers to such accidents in 33 years. Over 800 Harriers have been built. They will be replaced by over 600 F-35Bs by the end of the next decade.

The British Royal Navy's two carriers were built to carry sixteen Harrier GR9 aircraft each. Normally they carry eight, but because of the reduction of the Harrier force (two dozen older Sea Harriers were retired in 2006), and merging Royal Air Force and Royal Navy Harriers into a joint task force, plus the demand for Harriers in Afghanistan, and aircraft sidelined for maintenance and upgrades, there developed a shortage. Thus one British carrier recently put to sea with only four Harriers. The Royal Navy is building two new 65,000 ton carriers, to replace the three current 21,000 ton carriers (one of them inactive and in reserve). Britain is buying American F-35B vertical takeoff aircraft, and the new carriers will carry 24 F-35Bs each. But these aircraft, and the new carriers, won't be in service for another 6-8 years. So the Harrier shortage will be a problem for a while.

The F-35B, which will replace the Harrier, is a 27 ton aircraft that can carry six tons of weapons and is stealthy. In vertical takeoff mode, the F-35B will carry about twice the weapons as the Harrier, and have about twice the range (800 kilometers). But that is then, the Harrier is now, and probably will still be in service by the time the 50 year mark (2019) rolls around.

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John G    Cobblers!   3/24/2009 9:38:38 AM
"The Harrier was developed jointly by U.S. and British firms" really first I've heard. I know the AV8B was developed from the harrier and subsequently the P.1127 and that the kestral was tested in the US but jointly developed by the US and Britain? I dont think so. In fact I would say that Britain has had more development in the F-35 than the US in the Harrier.
 
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LB    FAA F-35 In Service Date   3/24/2009 5:34:06 PM
To state the FAA will have F-35s in "another 6-8 years" would be very big news if accurate.  In fact last I was aware the MOD has not yet ordered any test aircraft.  First these test aircraft need to be ordered, gotten into service, and gone through an entire flight test regime before the MOD has stated it will then decide whether or not to order the F-35.  When then might be and for what delivery date is unknown but it certainly will not be 6-8 years.  Exactly what date a sqdn will hit IOC, much less be fully equipped, is not knowable at this time.
 
Also as the previous person posted the Harrier was originally an all British design later purchased by the USMC, among others, as the AV-8A.  The AV-8B, however, was a joint US and British design built to replace the AV-8A.
 
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SATCtech    Harrier development   3/24/2009 10:15:24 PM
Both LB and John G need to do some research into the MWDP -  Mutual Weapons Development Program and the TES - Tripartite Evaluation Squadron and learn the role of the United States, particularly the taxpayers, in the development of the Kestrel/Harrier.
 
As for the AV-8B, for all intents and purposes, after the British government killed funding in 1975, the work fell solely to McDonnell Douglas until the Brits returned to the project in 1980.
 
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Phaid       3/25/2009 5:07:53 AM

To state the FAA will have F-35s in "another 6-8 years" would be very big news if accurate.  In fact last I was aware the MOD has not yet ordered any test aircraft.  First these test aircraft need to be ordered, gotten into service, and gone through an entire flight test regime before the MOD has stated it will then decide whether or not to order the F-35.  When then might be and for what delivery date is unknown but it certainly will not be 6-8 years.  Exactly what date a sqdn will hit IOC, much less be fully equipped, is not knowable at this time.


 

Also as the previous person posted the Harrier was originally an all British design later purchased by the USMC, among others, as the AV-8A.  The AV-8B, however, was a joint US and British design built to replace the AV-8A.



MoD orders three test fighter aircraft
 
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John G    Read up on it...   3/25/2009 9:00:23 AM
As I said the Kestarl was tested in the US as part of the TES but P31127  was well and truly flying in 1960 well before the TES was set up in 1964 and also as above just because it was partly funded by NATO (under the mwdp) doesn't mean that it was developed partly by the US and just to reiterate I would say the UK has just as much  involvement in the F-35 program if not more yet I would be hesitant to say that it was developed by the US and britain.
 
 
 
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prometheus       3/25/2009 9:06:08 AM
Let's make a deal then, the Brits will concede that the original Harrier was a joint development if the americans start referring to the F-35 as a US/UK aircraft
 
 
 
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prometheus       3/25/2009 9:11:35 AM

As I said the Kestarl was tested in the US as part of the TES but P31127  was well and truly flying in 1960 well before the TES was set up in 1964 and also as above just because it was partly funded by NATO (under the mwdp) doesn't mean that it was developed partly by the US and just to reiterate I would say the UK has just as much  involvement in the F-35 program if not more yet I would be hesitant to say that it was developed by the US and britain.

 

 


On two of the three models of the F-35 I can see your point, as it stands, BAE provides aft fuselage and empennages, horizontal and vertical tails, crew life support and escape systems, EW systems, fuel system, and Flight Control Software (FCS1)....
 
On top of which Rolls Royce provides the lift fan ( a somewhat vital ocmponent) for all F-35Bs as well as 40% of the F-136 engine (which you'd assume RR would lobby the UK gov hard to select for UK aircraft).
 
Thus, for UK F-35s there si a strong possibility of being 40% British built/designed in there......
 
which considering that the UK only put in 2 billion into the entire project is a hell of a bargain in terms of industrial workshare and I.P.
 
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LB    MOD orders test planes   3/25/2009 9:27:17 PM
Please note the article cited, dated last week, has delivery in 2011 or 2012 of 3 aircraft for a flight test regime lasting to 2014.  That is the earliest point MOD will then begin making actual decisions about how many aircraft to order.  Anyone paying attention to how quickly MOD has been making decisions like this the past decade or so will be aware of what the likely time frame might be.  Indeed FT also reported testimony in the Commons from MOD that the choice to purchase F-35 will only be made after the flight test program and that whether the F-35 was ordered depended entirely upon those results.
 
Retiring the Shar (Sea Harrier) in 2006 leaving the FAA without an air defense fighter for more than 10 years not only was a terrible short sighted budget cutting measure but the joint harrier force just keeps getting smaller.  The institutional memory of FAA air defense doctrine, training, and experience has been left to wither and die.  Last time an RN carrier sailed I believe there were less than half a dozen harriers available seeing as they are being used up in Afghanistan- mostly because of the similarly stupid early retirement of Jaguar.

 
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John G    Prometheus ...   3/26/2009 9:23:42 AM
I've always thought we had an overly generous portion of the work considering we put such a small amount in the actual development phase. I dont know much detail about the F-35 procurement work/contact and am now wondering whether we would still get that portion of work if we didn't order any aircraft at all (apart from the 3 test a/c we've just ordered). Does anyone know?
 
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