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Air Defense: America Buys Into New Israeli Tech
   Next Article → WARPLANES: On A New Wing And An Old Prayer
December 30, 2011: The U.S. has agreed to invest another $235 million in Israeli anti-missile efforts. The money is going to two systems. The less well-known one is the David's Sling/Magic Wand air and missile defense system being developed as a replacement for the American Patriot system. The Magic Wand missiles have a longer range (300 kilometers) and better capabilities than Patriot. The American manufacturer of Patriot is cooperating with work on Magic Wand and the U.S. investment gives America access to any new technology. Magic Wand is expected to be ready for service in 2-3 years and would eventually replace Israeli Hawk and Patriot anti-aircraft batteries.

A year ago there were successful tests of the Stunner missiles (yet another development of the Israeli Python heat seeking air-to-air missile) to be used by Magic Wand. Stunner apparently came out of the work to develop the Spyder anti-aircraft missile.

Spyder is a mobile short range system using, as many such systems do these days, air-to-air missiles. Spyder launchers (truck mounted, with four box like launch cells each) can carry either the Python 5 heat seeking missile (3.22 meters/ten feet long, 105 kg/231 pounds, with a range of 15 kilometers) or the Derby radar guided missile (3.6 meters/11.2 feet long, 122 kg/267 pounds, with a range of 65 kilometers). The Derby is actually a larger Python, with more fuel and a different guidance system. Stunner appears to be a slightly longer Spyder/Derby missile with dual seekers in the nose.

The Spyder radar system has a maximum range of 100 kilometers. The missiles can hit targets as high as 9 kilometers (28,000 feet) and as low as 20 meters (65 feet). With boosters (to increase speed at launch) and the right seekers, a modified Spyder could take down incoming long-range rockets. Magic Wand depends on longer range radars to get target location and speed information to the Spyder/Magic Wand launchers. Once launched, the Stunner is guided to the general location of the incoming rocket until the Stunner's on-board sensors pick it up and then home in and destroy the long range rocket.

Then there is Arrow. In 2010 Israel formed a third battery of Arrow anti-missile missiles. The battery will have the new Oren Adir (Magnificent Pine) radar, which has a longer range and is better able to identify potential targets than the existing Green Pine radar. The two older batteries have over a hundred missiles available. An Arrow battery has 4-8 launchers and each launcher carries six missiles in containers. The Arrow was developed to knock down Scud type missiles fired from Syria, Saudi Arabia, or Iraq. The two ton Arrow 1 is being replaced with the 1.3 ton Arrow 2, which can shoot down ballistic missiles fired from Iran. Israel is currently developing and testing an upgraded Arrow 2, which can take down longer range Iranian missiles. The even more effective Arrow 3 is not expected to be ready for use for at least three years.

The United States has long shared the expense of developing the Israeli Arrow anti-missile missile system. This includes contributing over a hundred million dollars for work on the Arrow 3. More than half the nearly three billion dollar cost of developing and building Arrow has come from the United States. In addition, American firms have done some of the development work or contributed technology. The U.S. has also provided Israel with a mobile X-band radar that enables it to detect incoming ballistic missiles farther away. Currently, the Israeli Green Pine radar can only detect a ballistic missile fired from Iran when the missile warhead is about two minutes from hitting a target in Israel. The X-band radar allows the Iranian missile to be spotted when it is 5-6 minutes away, enabling the Israeli Arrow anti-missile missile to hit the Iranian warhead farther away and with greater certainty. The Arrow 3 is expected to need something like the X-band radar to take advantage of the longer missile range. The Arrow 3 could also use satellite or UAV warnings of distant ballistic missile launches. Arrow 3 weighs about half as much as Arrow 2 and costs about a third less. First tests of Arrow 3 are to take place next year.

In 2010 Israel began increasing the production of its Arrow anti-missile missiles. Costing over three million dollars each, and partly constructed in the United States (by Boeing), the Arrow missiles are Israel's principal defense against Syrian and Iranian ballistic missiles. Since Arrow entered service ten years ago, only about 120 missiles have been built. Currently, Israel has over a hundred Arrow missiles available and would like to increase that to 200 in the next few years.

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heraldabc    Its a neat trick...   12/30/2011 8:15:47 AM
To get around congressional funding bans and  the idiotic ABM treaty. It also gives us access to some fine engineers and their good product while keeping the PRC bandits clueless.
 
Hope the gambit works.
 
H.
 
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CaseHardened       12/31/2011 10:58:44 PM
Great.  We get to spend money in Israel (who's economy is doing just fine thank you) to replace the Patriot technology Israel sold to China.
But, at least they gave us that great intel on Iraqi WMDs ... right?
 
http://tech.mit.edu/V112/N13/china.13w.html
 
" target="_blank">link
 
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heraldabc       1/1/2012 12:42:39 AM
We got that intel from Saudi Arabia, Great Britain, Germany, and ITALY. it was 80% accurate.
 
I wish you internet geniuses were less 9-11 Troofer and more SKEPTICAL and careful (sarcasm).
 
 
It might also interest you to know that it wasn't Israel who betrayed Patriot. 
 
 
 
 
If you must know it was our good friends, the SAUDIS, who handed over the then crown jewel of American SAM systems. Even at that though, the PRC bandits screwed up their HQ-9 royally. Why the HELL do you think they bought and still buy the Russian S-300 system?
 
H.

Great.  We get to spend money in Israel (who's economy is doing just fine thank you) to replace the Patriot technology Israel sold to China.

But, at least they gave us that great intel on Iraqi WMDs ... right?


 
link


 
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CaseHardened       1/1/2012 9:22:21 AM
Oy! And the Saudis gave the Chinese the Lavi design so they could build the J-10 too?  Who knew?
 
 
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heraldabc    Red Herring. This is about the Patriot    1/1/2012 9:31:48 AM
charge you made that was a pack of lies...
 
And it was with OUR blessing at the time we suggested that Israel pass on the failed Lavi, kumquat.
 
Not everything that the Reagan Administration did was SMART.

Oy! And the Saudis gave the Chinese the Lavi design so they could build the J-10 too?  Who knew?

 

That J-10 crashes and kills pilots a LOT as a result. You might be interested to know why one of these days.\
 
Sheesh, why do I get all the nuts?
 
H.
 
 
 
 
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CaseHardened       1/1/2012 2:41:02 PM
Believe what you'd like about Israel's reluctance to treat the  US like a crack whore for their own benefit.  On the Lavi I leave it to you to correct the Jerusalem Post  ...
 
"the US vetoed the Israeli-made Lavi and exports by our defense and aviation industries."
 
" target="_blank">link
 
 
 

 
 
 
 
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heraldabc    ZAnd your link still doesn't work...   1/1/2012 5:30:35 PM
 
 
It helps if you KNOW what actually happened.
 
H.
 


Believe what you'd like about Israel's reluctance to treat the  US like a crack whore for their own benefit.  On the Lavi I leave it to you to correct the Jerusalem Post  ...

 



"the US vetoed the Israeli-made Lavi and exports by our defense and aviation industries."
 



 
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CaseHardened       1/1/2012 10:12:30 PM
Sorry, I don't see where your links substantiate that the transfer of Lavi technology to China was approved by the US.   And that really is the point isn't it?    
 
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heraldabc    its mopre complex than that...   1/1/2012 10:48:31 PM
and as I actually said; you have to KNOW what actually happened. I gave it to you in black and white and you still don't see it.
 
Mark you down as incapable, I guess.
 
One more thing, Thiis is about  PATRIOT, where you already conceded that you don't know what the hell you discuss. Could it be that you don't have a clue about the Lavi as well? 
 
Or would you like to know the role of McDonnell Douglass et al in the route to the J-10?
 
 
 
 
 

Sorry, I don't see where your links substantiate that the transfer of Lavi technology to China was approved by the US.   And that really is the point isn't it?    



 
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CaseHardened       1/2/2012 1:23:25 AM
So what's Janes say? 

Chinese J-10 'benefited from the Lavi project'

By Robert Hewson

5/19/2008

"Russian aerospace engineers have confirmed to Jane's that China's Chengdu J-10 fighter aircraft benefited from significant, direct input from Israel's Lavi programme - including access to the Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) Lavi aircraft itself."

Israel's relationship with the US is clear enough.  USS Liberty, Pollard, Mel Paisley and the UAV deal, AMDOCS, and on and on. 
 
As you have said of another untrustworthy 'friend'  ...

We do not forgive treachery, EVER.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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