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Subject: French Defense Spending Review - CVF?
Armchair Private    7/10/2007 9:38:45 PM
ht*p://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/frances-sarkozy-softening-on-defense-after-electoral-stumble-03401/#more-3401 :-(
 
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Armchair Private       7/10/2007 9:42:41 PM
Any thoughts?



 
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Yimmy       7/10/2007 9:56:56 PM
I don't think the article says much of anything to be honest.

In any case, I am certain that the RN will get the two carriers.  What I am less sure about is our still having sufficient assets to escort them and cover our other needs.



 
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Armchair Private       7/10/2007 10:42:15 PM

I don't think the article says much of anything to be honest.

In any case, I am certain that the RN will get the two carriers.  What I am less sure about is our still having sufficient assets to escort them and cover our other needs.




It casts doubt on the likelihood of the French going ahead with the procurement of a sister carrier to the CVFs I think.

I hope you're correct, and up until about 3 months ago I would have said you were, but with the BAe investigation by the US (potentially scaring the Saudi's off of Typhoon), the fact that the second engine for JSF is up in the air again (less money for Rolls Royce) and the French wavering...

Somethings gotta go from the defense budget, or funding has to be increased.

 
 
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paul1970       7/11/2007 4:40:14 AM



I don't think the article says much of anything to be honest.

In any case, I am certain that the RN will get the two carriers.  What I am less sure about is our still having sufficient assets to escort them and cover our other needs.





It casts doubt on the likelihood of the French going ahead with the procurement of a sister carrier to the CVFs I think.

I hope you're correct, and up until about 3 months ago I would have said you were, but with the BAe investigation by the US (potentially scaring the Saudi's off of Typhoon), the fact that the second engine for JSF is up in the air again (less money for Rolls Royce) and the French wavering...

Somethings gotta go from the defense budget, or funding has to be increased.

 

would have thought that US investigation will mean that the Saudi's are less likely to buy American again, not put them off buying British...
Paul
 
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Yimmy       7/11/2007 1:22:27 PM
The American "investigation" is just dirty play to put a spanner in the works for the British arms deal, so that American companies can have their cake and eat it.

I can't see the Saudis being pressured so easily.


 
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flamingknives       7/11/2007 5:28:55 PM
In all fairness, given the US focus on ethical business behavior, I don't think that they could have ignored dodgy dealings with BAESystems, who are carving quite a little niche for themselves in North America. I do think, however, that they ought to restrict the investigation to current contracts rather than the decades-old Al yamarah deal. Else they'd better look into all the dodgy dealings that US contractors have been up to in the not-so-distant past.
 
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Armchair Private       7/11/2007 6:55:14 PM






I don't think the article says much of anything to be honest.

In any case, I am certain that the RN will get the two carriers.  What I am less sure about is our still having sufficient assets to escort them and cover our other needs.






It casts doubt on the likelihood of the French going ahead with the procurement of a sister carrier to the CVFs I think.

I hope you're correct, and up until about 3 months ago I would have said you were, but with the BAe investigation by the US (potentially scaring the Saudi's off of Typhoon), the fact that the second engine for JSF is up in the air again (less money for Rolls Royce) and the French wavering...

Somethings gotta go from the defense budget, or funding has to be increased.

 


would have thought that US investigation will mean that the Saudi's are less likely to buy American again, not put them off buying British...

Paul


They buy british cos we play nice with them. It's not so much a matter of them turning to the yanks, but more that if we are seen not to be able to protect their interests (the royal family's interests that is...) then the french, russians etc look more attractive.
 
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Armchair Private       7/11/2007 7:08:11 PM

In all fairness, given the US focus on ethical business behavior, I don't think that they could have ignored dodgy dealings with BAESystems, who are carving quite a little niche for themselves in North America. I do think, however, that they ought to restrict the investigation to current contracts rather than the decades-old Al yamarah deal. Else they'd better look into all the dodgy dealings that US contractors have been up to in the not-so-distant past.

I agree that in all likely hood this was not a conspiracy, more just due process. Having said that I imagine that the US defense giants did all their expensive lobbying best to get this investigation of the ground. Once it is of the ground though the process will go on regardless.

The problem here though is that the deal was not betwixt BAe and Saudi, but between HM Gov. and Saudi.... if the US follows this they may find it leading more to civil servants and Ministers than BAe executives. If you then take into account the fact that US courts no longer need to provide any evidence to british courts in order to extradite British citizens (which by the way effectively makes us all subject to US law - a country in which last time I checked i didn't have any sort of vote - thanks Tony) the fall out could be immense!
 
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Yimmy       7/11/2007 7:39:25 PM



The problem here though is that the deal was not betwixt BAe and Saudi, but between HM Gov. and Saudi.... if the US follows this they may find it leading more to civil servants and Ministers than BAe executives. If you then take into account the fact that US courts no longer need to provide any evidence to british courts in order to extradite British citizens (which by the way effectively makes us all subject to US law - a country in which last time I checked i didn't have any sort of vote - thanks Tony) the fall out could be immense!

Well, HM has Her armed forces to ensure her position.  Her government does not... but then would it be so sad if those in government got dragged kicking and screaming to America?

 
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AdamB       7/13/2007 3:00:39 PM
Wouldn't it be great if the French navy didn't get the new carriers?
 
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