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Subject: Why all the hostilities towards China?
analdestroyer    1/19/2009 12:29:29 AM
I sometimes wonder why all the hostilities towards china in this forum?, i even read that someone suggested the US to send B2 to wreck chinese three gorges dam? where all of this come from, is it from jealousy?, certaintly not as you americans has been living so well off, is it because dare i say 'fear' as the chinese are rapidly catching up on you, certainly this is exagerrating, no matter how fast the chinese are growing its still decades away to be on the same footing as the US, or is it because they are different? different in their way of doing things that you guys are so worked up, different yet produces the same or arguably better results, for example china is not democracy so it must be evil, yes china is not democracy nor it needed to be at the moment, but its heading that way, for democracy to work first the state must achieve stability and to achieve stability means continuing economic growth, after all democray is where the people become more affluent and so they demand more say on how goverments run things, remember democray does not make western countries rich, they become rich because of colonization (mercantilism) and industrialization (which is what the chinese are doing), secondly your mantra of free market capitalism over state controlled economy, you seems to think that the state is naturally idiot and the market is naturally brilliant, guess again it was an epic mistake, it is you who now moving toward state control—by nationalizing the banking and car industries, and imposing heavy new regulation on the financial industry, accusing them of yuan depreciation while ignoring the fact that is has been increasing by 21.5% towards the dollars, the chinese are a nation of learners they learn from others success and mistakes, they want to avoid the fate of russia in 90's moving too fast from socialism economy to free market and democracy, you americans called it shock therapy which proves to be all shock and no therapy, and you might be suprised that 8 out of 9 of its top leaderships is engineers instead of attorneys and lawyers like in the US you should read this article on newsweek http://www.newsweek.com/id/178810/page/1 its quite rare US media potrays China in positive light
 
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analdestroyer       2/16/2009 7:30:34 AM



As i said in my post its 8 out of 9 top party leaders are engineers according to newsweek, not its president, and they are also the top leaderships in China, which also happen to be hu jintao top advisers,




Chinese human right records yes its bad and definetely need working on, but isn't it the case for most of major developing nations in the world?, why china its the only one in the spotlights, like the gujarat muslim massacre in india, which pretty much sanctioned by the local government,  the indian instution of caste is another example of gross human right violations, in which lower caste people is still called the untouchables, and did very menial and polluting work related to bodily decay and dirt, indonesia is another example of a country with a disgraful human right records, and religion violence, and your country itself is in disgrace forever by allowing torture for POWs



 






Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding

 

Chinese racism alert.

 

This guy is HIGHLY possible to be a PRC troll, people on CCPCPD payroll or just a stupid useful idiot.


 

Most Chinese don't know sh!t about India, and they look down upon India. Instead, I LIVE with Indians, WORK with Indian and my boss is from India. Indians never deny that they have caste problem in their society, albeit the law bans practice of it. However, Indians recognize that they don't have resources to deal the problem in a timely and nonviolent way, unlike commies, who always choose rapid social engineering regardless of how people like it or not.


 

A lot of Chinese will repeat the same kind of ignorance simply because they 1. never pay attention to anything about India and 2. feel superior when talk down on India with things like that. They don't seem to realize that peasants, migrate workers, and "rural residents" are not in better situation than untouchables of India. The irony is that people from inner provinces are openly discriminated by both government institution and "urban residents" of coastal cities. Compare caste in India, which is historic and illegal, and discrimination of dual residency (rural and urban) in China, which is institutionalized and actively enforced, well, that's just the FACT.


 

There are also religious violence in China. Instead of Hindu vs Islam, it is Atheist against all religion in China. In short, all the problems of India existed in China and are worse. However, Indians have some form of effective democracy, while Chinese are still under the jack boots of commies. Indians can reform peacefully under democratic system, though slowly, while Chinese have no right whatsoever but choice between rebel and sheep. More and more Chinese are choosing to rebel, and we'll see how it goes.


 

This forum is no racist, just Anglo-centric and, most of the time, don't really know how different people think. There are Indian, Albanian, Romanian, German, Blacks, Israeli, Turk, posting on this forum peacefully without any problem. It is commies trolls who need to look at themselves to see what kind of thing they are.



Jesus, so whoever here is posting anything positive about China is a troll and PRC agent, is that correct? and you claim yourself not be a racist, its like claiming Hitler is jewish human right defender, and according to your logic human rights abuses is okay as long as its done by a democratic country is that correct?, whats the use of laws if nobody care crap about them, its like saying rwanda has the law forbidding hutus massacring tutsis, your logic is flawed and backward just like what you claim China is, and it is also FACT that stability takes priority over democracy see Putin with Russia, is another FACT that Chinese economic reforms has brought millions of people out of poverty and keeping the jobs of those people is the main challenges and priority of Chinese goverment now
 
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analdestroyer       2/16/2009 8:25:36 AM

You get what you spew : /.

 

While I have to accept you as gay and can't lynch you (which I wouldn't have anyways), that doesn't mean I have to like it, and I am free to express my distaste for your orientation... all the more so on the internet really.

 

 

This is a conservative site, and you must take into account that a probable majority of regular posters here have conservative views. They may support more directly damaging attacks against China concerning how hypothetical situations. I'm fairly sure that most you talk to on here would not advocate doing this tomorrow. All the expressions of hostility i've seen towards China have been towards its current form of government, and the way it goes about things. Unless you are a Chinese government official or ultra-nationalist Chinese, it shouldn't really bother you.

 

Free market vs Gov't control is hit and miss really. The market is great when its in good times, and gov't intervention may be needed in bad times. History has not shown good results for pre-dominantly government controlled economies, that's all. Any wealth from colonization in Europe was probably wiped out by the end of WW2, when much of Europe was rubble., so moot argument.

 

The industries you state are being nationalized aren't intended to stay nationalized. Off the top of my head, I remember hearing that the financial industry crisis was created through deregulation of the financial industry, allowing bad loans to people with no real means based on a hope the economy would forever go up and up and up (unrealistic). So isn't the heavy regulation really just a return? There are surely others on here that could explain this for or against what i've stated better than I could.

 

The Chinese people aren't involved in the decision process, so whether they are a nation of learners or not is irrelevant, the heads will do what they must to maintain power... in good times and bad. I havn't seen any reall moves towards a true democracy. I've seen a move towards capitalism, but there is still one party controlling the country permanently.

 

It seems you use this B2 comment over the 3 gorges dam as the poster of your argument. This is a valid tactic of total war, and one which would probably be very effective. Depending on the context, this is not hostile at all.


Good I chew well and ready to spit it in your face, see at least we got something in common which is  'hatred' but im still able to be objective and not try not to judge unless provoked first,
 
Yes i notice that this is a consevative site, but being conservative does not mean not being able to be objective, not everything you see that you don't like is bad, there is something positive is that bad thing as well, depending on society, democracy may work and may not worked, this has been proven throughout history, just like recently Muamar Khadafi said that democray would not work in Africa, with good reasons, due to its tribal mentality democracy will just spark new wars in africa http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7870431.stm and Putin prefence of stability over democracy in Russia, can you tell them straight in their face that democracy will work best for their countries?
 
The most profound impact of colonization is the creation of USA as a country, to emerge as the wealthiest country in the world until now,
 
Yes you are right with good economic reasons some industries will have to go back to civillian hands in the US, but you have to admit that things will never be the same again, Federal regulation of the economy will expand, on everything from financial management companies to electricity generation and personal energy use, nationalized health care, Kyoto-like global-warming policies, and increased education regulation and spending, basically europeanization of US under obama

Yes it is a solid military target, under some extreme situation such total war,which we all know its impossible to happen in modern times without inflicting serious damage to both sides
 
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YelliChink       2/16/2009 9:28:47 AM


Jesus, so whoever here is posting anything positive about China is a troll and PRC agent, is that correct? and you claim yourself not be a racist, its like claiming Hitler is jewish human right defender, and according to your logic human rights abuses is okay as long as its done by a democratic country is that correct?, whats the use of laws if nobody care crap about them, its like saying rwanda has the law forbidding hutus massacring tutsis, your logic is flawed and backward just like what you claim China is, and it is also FACT that stability takes priority over democracy see Putin with Russia, is another FACT that Chinese economic reforms has brought millions of people out of poverty and keeping the jobs of those people is the main challenges and priority of Chinese goverment now

1. Yes, you are a commie troll.
 
2. Only commies will support radical social change to get rid of social injustice, which did nothing but introduce more social injustice in favor of  party members against general population. All the discrimination and social injustice still permeate through Indian society are jokes when it comes to systematic oppression that commies exert upon Uighurs, Tibetans, Chinese dissidents, FLG, Chritians, peasant workers, peasants and the list goes on. More than 600 million people have been murdered by this disgusting regime called PRC, more than any inadequate examples you commie troll have mentioned and combined.
 
3. Commies didn't do anything but "deregulate" from Stalinist system to slightly freer  economic system. Chinese dig themselves out the pile of crap called communism. In really, commies are still in their way to fortune. Your fact is so wrong that I don't know where to start. Had it not commies who put Chinese population in the crap hole called communism, there would have been no need of the "reform" at all.
 
4. The importance for "stability" promulgated from commie troll like you means stability for commies to keep sitting on top of Chinese population. That's the kind of stability you want. This is intrinsically unstable and commies know that they are siting on a volcano caldron. Ask yourself why there is no "stability" problem in India? Why is there no "stability" problem in Europe? Why is there no "stability" problem in the US? Because Chinese people HATE commies.
 

 
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YelliChink       2/16/2009 9:55:41 AM
Ooops, I mean 60 million murdered by commies. 600 million is typo.
 
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analdestroyer       2/17/2009 4:01:48 AM





Jesus, so whoever here is posting anything positive about China is a troll and PRC agent, is that correct? and you claim yourself not be a racist, its like claiming Hitler is jewish human right defender, and according to your logic human rights abuses is okay as long as its done by a democratic country is that correct?, whats the use of laws if nobody care crap about them, its like saying rwanda has the law forbidding hutus massacring tutsis, your logic is flawed and backward just like what you claim China is, and it is also FACT that stability takes priority over democracy see Putin with Russia, is another FACT that Chinese economic reforms has brought millions of people out of poverty and keeping the jobs of those people is the main challenges and priority of Chinese goverment now





1. Yes, you are a commie troll.
 

2. Only commies will support radical social change to get rid of social injustice, which did nothing but introduce more social injustice in favor of  party members against general population. All the discrimination and social injustice still permeate through Indian society are jokes when it comes to systematic oppression that commies exert upon Uighurs, Tibetans, Chinese dissidents, FLG, Chritians, peasant workers, peasants and the list goes on. More than 600 million people have been murdered by this disgusting regime called PRC, more than any inadequate examples you commie troll have mentioned and combined.


 

3. Commies didn't do anything but "deregulate" from Stalinist system to slightly freer  economic system. Chinese dig themselves out the pile of crap called communism. In really, commies are still in their way to fortune. Your fact is so wrong that I don't know where to start. Had it not commies who put Chinese population in the crap hole called communism, there would have been no need of the "reform" at all.


 

4. The importance for "stability" promulgated from commie troll like you means stability for commies to keep sitting on top of Chinese population. That's the kind of stability you want. This is intrinsically unstable and commies know that they are siting on a volcano caldron. Ask yourself why there is no "stability" problem in India? Why is there no "stability" problem in Europe? Why is there no "stability" problem in the US? Because Chinese people HATE commies.


 




1. Sure you can call me a commie troll for whatever reason in your head, to be equally racist you are a curry loving towelhead hairy monkey indian ass licker  i didn't fire the first shot, but willling to dance all night long
 
2 if you are talking about the effects during the Cultural Revolution, not all was mindless violence, it was an historic event without precedent. In a situation in which a socialist system had been established, Mao and the revolutionaries in the Chinese Communist Party mobilized the activism and creativity of the masses to prevent the restoration of the old order and to carry forward the socialist revolution towards communism: the elimination of classes and all oppressive relations. History has never seen a mass movement and struggle of such scale and guided by such revolutionary politics and consciousness. History has never seen so radical an attempt to transform economic relations, political and social institutions, and culture, habit, and ideas.
Were there mistakes and shortcomings in the Cultural Revolution? Yes, even some serious ones. But viewed in the context of its enormous achievements, these are secondary.
 
some of its achivements
 

Education.

China's universities--which in the early 1960s were still the province of the sons and daughters of intellectuals, cadres, and the former privileged classes--were transformed. The old curriculum was overhauled as part of meeting the needs of building an egalitarian society. Autocratic teaching methods were criticized. At all levels, education was taken as much more than just classroom schooling--it was understood to be a broad social and lifelong

 
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Godofgamblers       2/17/2009 5:53:42 AM











Jesus, so whoever here is posting anything positive about China is a troll and PRC agent, is that correct? and you claim yourself not be a racist, its like claiming Hitler is jewish human right defender, and according to your logic human rights abuses is okay as long as its done by a democratic country is that correct?, whats the use of laws if nobody care crap about them, its like saying rwanda has the law forbidding hutus massacring tutsis, your logic is flawed and backward just like what you claim China is, and it is also FACT that stability takes priority over democracy see Putin with Russia, is another FACT that Chinese economic reforms has brought millions of people out of poverty and keeping the jobs of those people is the main challenges and priority of Chinese goverment now












1. Yes, you are a commie troll.


 



2. Only commies will support radical social change to get rid of social injustice, which did nothing but introduce more social injustice in favor of  party members against general population. All the discrimination and social injustice still permeate through Indian society are jokes when it comes to systematic oppression that commies exert upon Uighurs, Tibetans, Chinese dissidents, FLG, Chritians, peasant workers, peasants and the list goes on. More than 600 million people have been murdered by this disgusting regime called PRC, more than any inadequate examples you commie troll have mentioned and combined.






 



3. Commies didn't do anything but "deregulate" from Stalinist system to slightly freer  economic system. Chinese dig themselves out the pile of crap called communism. In really, commies are still in their way to fortune. Your fact is so wrong that I don't know where to start. Had it not commies who put Chinese population in the crap hole called communism, there would have been no need of the "reform" at all.






 



4. The importance for "stability" promulgated from commie troll like you means stability for commies to keep sitting on top of Chinese population. That's the kind of stability you want. This is intrinsically unstable and commies know that they are siting on a volcano caldron. Ask yourself why there is no "stability" problem in India? Why is there no "stability" problem in Europe? Why is there no "stability" problem in the US? Because Chinese people HATE commies.






 











1. Sure you can call me a commie troll for whatever reason in your head, to be equally racist you are a curry loving towelhead hairy monkey indian ass licker  i didn't fire the first shot, but willling to dance all night long

 

2 if you are talking about the effects during the Cultural Revolution, not all was mindless violence, it was an historic event without precedent. In a situation in which a socialist system had been established, Mao and the revolutionaries in the Chinese Communist Party mobilized the activism and creativity of the masses to prevent the restoration of the old order and to carry forward the socialist revolution towards communism: the elimination of classes and all oppressive relations. History has never seen a mass movement and struggle of such scale and guided by such revolutionary politics and consciousness. History has never seen so radical an attempt to transform economic relations, political and social institutions, and culture, habit, and ideas.


Were there mistakes and shortcomings in the Cultural Revolution? Yes, even some serious ones. But viewed in the context of its enormou
 
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HERALD1357    Wer have a gang of fourn (sìrén bāng) idiot here?   2/17/2009 5:56:51 AM
You realize that the gangsters: Deng Xiaoping, Ye Jianying and the arch criminal, Zhou Enlai, smashed the Cultural Revolution, arrested the Gang of Four, and reversed the so called reforms at the PLA's insistance?
 
Or do you think your propaganda flies on wings of lies, little yapper?     
 
Herald 
 
 
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YelliChink       2/17/2009 10:53:50 AM

1. Sure you can call me a commie troll for whatever reason in your head, to be equally racist you are a curry loving towelhead hairy monkey indian ass licker  i didn't fire the first shot, but willling to dance all night long



You are so ignorant about history of WG, and you seem to forget that there was no rice in the bowl during 1959-1962 "Mao-made" disaster. In short, you are a commie, and that is now proven true. I didn't call you name merely as an insult. Instead, I call you a commie because you are a commie, as you have proven yourself already. Your ignorance on other's culture and social problems is equally staggering. Given your knowledge level about WG, I can come up with the conclusion that you are also ignorant about the rest of Chinese history, probably except the part where commie historians tried so hard to fit Marxist historic views to incompatible Chinese history. The more you post, the more you reveal you're indeed a commie troll.
 
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strat-T21C    Easy boys!   2/17/2009 11:19:08 AM
Cut down on the personal insults and racist crap, it achieves nothing but further dissent!
 
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strat-T21C    Why????, why not!   2/17/2009 11:37:45 AM

I sometimes wonder why all the hostilities towards china in this forum?, i even read that someone suggested the US to send B2 to wreck chinese three gorges dam? where all of this come from, is it from jealousy?, certaintly not as you americans has been living so well off, is it because dare i say 'fear' as the chinese are rapidly catching up on you, certainly this is exagerrating, no matter how fast the chinese are growing its still decades away to be on the same footing as the US, or is it because they are different? different in their way of doing things that you guys are so worked up, different yet produces the same or arguably better results, for example china is not democracy so it must be evil, yes china is not democracy nor it needed to be at the moment, but its heading that way, for democracy to work first the state must achieve stability and to achieve stability means continuing economic growth, after all democray is where the people become more affluent and so they demand more say on how goverments run things, remember democray does not make western countries rich, they become rich because of colonization (mercantilism) and industrialization (which is what the chinese are doing), secondly your mantra of free market capitalism over state controlled economy, you seems to think that the state is naturally idiot and the market is naturally brilliant, guess again it was an epic mistake, it is you who now moving toward state control?by nationalizing the banking and car industries, and imposing heavy new regulation on the financial industry, accusing them of yuan depreciation while ignoring the fact that is has been increasing by 21.5% towards the dollars, the chinese are a nation of learners they learn from others success and mistakes, they want to avoid the fate of russia in 90's moving too fast from socialism economy to free market and democracy, you americans called it shock therapy which proves to be all shock and no therapy, and you might be suprised that 8 out of 9 of its top leaderships is engineers instead of attorneys and lawyers like in the US

you should read this article on newsweeklink
its quite rare US media potrays China in positive light
The Gov't of China is deserving of it , that's why.
The PRC's policies/attitudes regarding human rights, human trafficing, industrial espionage and piritical theft, the purposefull undervalueing of the yaun and sweat shops(slave labor) are only the tip of the iceburg.
Constant interfearance in foriegn soverign nations through state sponsored Maoist terror groups in BURMA and Nepal, the brutal occupation and ethnic cleansing in Tibet. Absurd, unfounded territorial claims, in the Spratly and Parcel Is. to name a few.
In short, while I'm absolutly positive that the majority of the Chinese people are a normal, freindly bunch who would make a great neighbor, the CHI-COM gov't is a corrupt, murderous bunch of  out-of touch old men who deserve a dance on the end of a rope!
  

 
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