To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD)

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bsl RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/24/2002 7:30:21 PM

good luck

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CP RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/27/2002 9:11:10 AM

If you do anything, take the time to replace every instance of the word "infidel" in the Koran with the word "Muslim." Maybe THAT will wake you up.

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veritas RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/30/2002 2:17:17 AM

This is Pakistani I will not post as veritas I have come to the conclusion that Islamic brotherhood comands that there be only one Islamic state so that it has one forigen policy intrest not many forigen policy intrests competeing with each other. As such I now regard Pakistan as a state with a weak ideological justification. If it was created for the sake of Islam it should join with other muslim countires for the sake of brotherhood. If it was created for nationalistic reasons that is a indeed a very sick thing because islam regards nationalism as sickness that does more harm than good.

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CP RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/30/2002 4:56:52 PM

A pan-Islamic state would have but one foreign policy initiative - expansion through warfare. Please unite! It would make the war on terrorism easier if you were all the same country.

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pfd RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/31/2002 2:42:23 AM

... Please expand on this.

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CP to pfd RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 3/31/2002 9:49:42 AM

Not sure if you were directing that at me, but if all the pan-Islamicists succeeded in uniting a "Greater People's Republic of Ancient Moon God Worshippers," we'd have one big, goofy-but-batshit-crazy country we could turn into a TLAM-N range, rather than going into the 60 odd seperate countries to root them out.

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veritas RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 4/4/2002 4:35:41 PM

Pfd, What I ment to say was that Islam frowns upon Nationalism and regards it as an extention of racism. Hence Pakistan is a odd state, since it was "created in the name of Islam" but now claims its own national idenity. A pan-Islamic state would not be a war-mongering empire like CP would have you think. If the forigen policy is based on Islam, and it has to be if there is to be consinentiy, the state would not attack another state for resources/economic gains or other strategic considertations such as "national intrest". I know this sounds a bit radicalised and idealistic but we are not allowed to kill people aside from the cause of Justice. The only ligimit war would be in self defense or to dispose of tyrants (Saddam/Saudis) that enslave the Muslim nation. An Islamic state is essintal because without a state even ligitmit acts of war are PURELY murder. Allah has only allowed us to take life for justice. To kill for a micro-hatred like nationlism is idiotic. Secondly it would also enforce that unislamic pratices in warfare such as sucide bombings etc. are not carried out under the name of Islam. Islamicly it is EXPLICTLY forbidden to kill non-combatants. This will have an intresting effect on a nuclear doctrine if such a state were to have the capiblity. These are just the military considerations to why there has to be an Islamic state. Other considerations range from religous , i.e. the Prophet bhaved in a specific manner when he ruled Medina, to the political , (Islam has its own political system were the exeuctive is directly elected and judical is supreme and legislation is with the judical branch which derives laws from the Quran or Sunnah. Private indivudals can appeal any law. It remains the Caliphs duty to make sure the laws are not a burden on the people and both instututions have a check on each other. There is also a Quasi-Parliment whose real role is not legislation but rather to dispose of any part of the govermnet that becomes corroupt. My point is that Islam is NOT ONLY a religon but a socio-economic system , a political system, a nation, an ideology and a civiliztion.) To be honest I had not previously reliased the NON-spritual side of Islam until recently. I have had to revise a lot of my ideas because of my new understanding. An Islamic State is also essintal because it is needed to solve many of the problems that the Muslims are facing today. If I were to explain this to you in secular terms I would point out that the only natural philosophy that all muslims can universaly accept is Islam and the rule of Islam is the only way the RULE OF LAW can be estalbised in the Islamic world. From a reliogus point I would dare suggest that the Economic/political systems of Islam are unique and would indeed be a solution to our predicment. They worked well for a 1000 years until decline set in. An Islamic state would surely stablise the world situation today. There would be ligimit resistance to tyranny not a tyranny shall beget more tyranny response. Is there anything else you want me to elobrate on?

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Vulture RE:To Jeff, Bsl , Pheonix, and everyone else with a brain (does not include CP and DD) 4/4/2002 5:24:58 PM

Veritas/Pakistani/? said "If I were to explain this to you in secular terms I would point out that the only natural philosophy that all muslims can universaly accept is Islam and the rule of Islam is the only way the RULE OF LAW can be estalbised in the Islamic world." So you want Sharia to be the law of this Islamic State? Well that justifies CPs case of "wipe 'em out" now. Calling it a "FAIR" judicial system is something I would only expect to hear from someone like the "The Goof" ,excuse me,"The Truth" Of the 6 schools of Islamic Religious law I am familar with, they all promote the idea that an Islamic witness's testimony has greater validity than that of a non muslim. And most of those schools say that a man's testimony outweighs a woman's. And by not letting Sharia law be used when muslims are tried in some rational country, the cry of tyranny (historical fact) would go out. Then you get Jihad against non muslim states based on a flawed religious system. No Thanks, Next!

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CP BULLSHIT BULLSHIT BULLSHIT!!!!! 4/4/2002 6:57:15 PM

"A pan-Islamic state would not be a war-mongering empire like CP would have you think. If the forigen policy is based on Islam, and it has to be if there is to be consinentiy, the state would not attack another state for resources/economic gains or other strategic considertations such as "national intrest". BULLSHIT! If this were true, Islamic worship-the-moon-or-die fanatics would have confined themselves to the Arabian peninsula from the Battle of Badr to the present day.