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Subject: ASTER 30 more efficient than Arrow, patriot?
nominoe    6/19/2007 10:26:06 AM
in french, sorry : h*tp://www.israelvalley.com/news/2007/03/02/9027/israel-france-revelations-le-nouveau-missile-anti-missile-francais-aster-30-serait-plus-performant-que-l-arrow this article says that ASTER 30 could be used by Israel to face missile threats, and that it has many advantages : - compact, so better mobility - can be used with ARABEL radar, 360 vs 120 for other systems - vertical launch - thrust vect. up to 50G. I Don't really know what are the real facts, but could ASTER 30 be a good system for israel?
 
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Herald1234    No.   6/19/2007 12:20:06 PM
 
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french stratege       6/19/2007 4:02:50 PM
Aster lauch now
h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TahVQ4bij-A&mode=related&search=
Compare outstanding acceleration.Aster remind me the Sprint missile a little.
h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFNOLHMOZWM
h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU34I0BkJQQ&mode=related&search=
 
Compare to SM2 for exemple:
h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3RKn_7Pcw0&mode=related&search=
 
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Softwar    Proper Comparison   6/19/2007 4:50:02 PM

Aster lauch now

h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TahVQ4bij-A&mode=related&search=

Compare outstanding acceleration.Aster remind me the Sprint missile a little.

h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFNOLHMOZWM

h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU34I0BkJQQ&mode=related&search=

 

Compare to SM2 for exemple:


h*tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3RKn_7Pcw0&mode=related&search=



FS - you know its hard to compare the launch of a 600 kg missile designed for intercepts out to 150 km and a 300 kg missile designed for intercepts out to 30 km.  Burn rate, grain, size of burn area, motor weight are all considerations that engineers make based on the payload, size, and range.  The spectacular Aster 15 take off is a design function - based on the short range and light payload.  The SM-2 has longer range, bigger payload requirements thus it does not travel that fast out of the launcher.  A better comparison would be the Sea Sparrow ESSM - which is similar in size, range and payload.

 

LINK

Evolved SeaSparrow Missile (ESSM)

SM-2
wgt 621 kg range 66-150 km

Sea Sparrow ESSM
wgt 280 kg range 50 km

Aster 15
wgt 310 kg range 1.7 - 30 km

 
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Softwar    Arrow - PAC3 - Thaad - SM-3/SM-2   6/19/2007 6:50:01 PM
 
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Bluewings12       6/20/2007 10:02:42 AM
""but could ASTER 30 be a good system for israel?""

ASTER is an excellent system for any user . It gets the job done .

Cheers .
 
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Softwar       6/20/2007 11:23:13 AM
BW
 
Can you post some details on Aster 30 and TBM intercept tests?
 
Thanks in advance!
 
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Phaid       6/20/2007 11:49:32 AM

BW

 

Can you post some details on Aster 30 and TBM intercept tests?

 

Thanks in advance!


LOL

 
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Bluewings12       6/20/2007 9:24:44 PM
Softwar :
""BW
 Can you post some details on Aster 30 and TBM intercept tests?
 Thanks in advance!""

Well , there is nothing I have that you cannot find on the Net .
You could start with the official website :
h*tp://www.mbda-systems.com/mbda/site/FO/scripts/siteFO_contenu.php?lang=EN&noeu_id=88

The problem is that some posters will try to counter every word I say just for the sake of it , Herald being a very good exemple .
I sincerly believe that ASTER SAM/T is the best system out there , not because I am French but because the technology involved is still unmatched .
Arrow looks the business too , but I don 't know much about that system .
Patriot , well , it 's half baked .
SM-3 is a strong and very good contender .

Israel wants something to counter any possible BM threat from Iran . They might well have a problem , with or without ASTER .
They need a hit-to-kill capability to make sure that the warhead gets destroyed ~ASTER can do that~ but if it is a biological warhead it wouldn 't help . It could even make things worse as the destroyed warhead ~even in high altitude~ will spread its poison all over the place .

It is a big problem ...

Cheers .


 
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gf0012-aust       6/20/2007 10:21:44 PM


They need a hit-to-kill capability to make sure that the warhead gets destroyed ~ASTER can do that~ but if it is a biological warhead it wouldn 't help . It could even make things worse as the destroyed warhead ~even in high altitude~ will spread its poison all over the place .

superficially speaking.....
 
a kinetic kill will/can still result in agent dispersal.  its certainly not going to guarantee a kill on a chem/bio warhead.
a thermobaric or a nuke is the only thing thats going to vaporise a chem bio warhead - and a thermobaric may not be able to do the job unless the incoming warhead has already been compromised.
if not the above, then  a big @rse warhead has to be used.  it would seem that if a chem/bio was inbound, then you'd need 2 launches.  1 for a warhead compromise and another for a proximity vapourise - all in quick succession (????)
 
I vaguely recall that petriot was volley launched due to some of the above issues.
 
 

 
 
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caltrop    High altitude dispersal   6/20/2007 10:58:56 PM
They need a hit-to-kill
capability to make sure that the warhead gets destroyed ~ASTER can do
that~ but if it is a biological warhead it wouldn 't help . It could
even make things worse as the destroyed warhead ~even in high altitude~
will spread its poison all over the place .
I am not an expert in chem/bio warfare but it seems to me the higher the altitude intercept (as possibly achieved by the SM3), the greater the dispersal of the agent and thus lessen the chance that the WMD would cause a great number of casualties. Obvioussly. the minimum requirement would be the break-up of the warhead.
 
Your immune system can fight off some anthrax spores, just not thousands and thousands all at once.  People who work with animals are exposed to low levels all the time.  I could see chemcial weapons posing a bit more of a risk but I do not think that fatalities would be involved.
 
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