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Subject: Interesting emails with anti-nuclear/anti-war activist...
NewGuy    12/4/2003 10:37:21 PM
I recently had an few brief email exchanges with the head of a prominent "anti-nuclear/anti-war" organization, I thought I would share bits of this banter, in order to show what kind of mentality we are dealing with in these groups. In one email I pointed out the following to this individual: "Yes, but your goal is effectively *unilateral* disarmament of the US and any other Western nation with a nuclear shield, since nuclear nations such as China, Russia, and those who are attempting to acquire them, like Iran and North Korea, are almost certainly not going to give up their weapons unless 'forced' to do so by some extraordinary means. Plus, there has been no plausible way presented to stop other nations from developing nuclear weapons, and then using then to threaten our nation or others -- please don't both to mention the UN organizations, and the IAEA, these organizations have demonstrated their inability in the past decades in preventing the spread of nuclear weapons technology to other nations, especially by those assisted by Russia and the PRC." This was his reply: "yup. Because at this point, what else will remove the incentive for other nations to have their own 'weapons of mass destruction"? Their greatest incentive is the U.S. possession and demonstrated will to use NWs. Fear drives people to extremes. I have faith enough in the people of the world that if our nation unilaterally disarmed itself of these weapons, no other government could sustain their own program against the popular revulsion to nuclear weapons. Remove this threat, and the leaders could no manipulate the fear of such attack to exert authoritarian control. I'd rather try it than condemn my children and their progeny to continued existance under a nuclear Sword of Damocles." My reply to this was the following: "You obviously have never met someone who valued violence or fear for its own sake and had no concept of justice or fairness. I personally have seen such human beings, some in places of power. Your idea that if we disarm, all of the despots of the world will somehow allow their people to convince them to remove their own weapons -- please explain, how will they do that, when they do not even have the power/ability to convince such evil men to grant them their basic human rights? Despots are usually in power because of the use of fear and a total lack of conscience, and most are not going to give up his power simply because *we* do. Frankly, that is a naive concept that is dangerous to our very survival if it were put into action. No, your idea on relying on the morality and decency of very "undecent" leaders of the likes of Saddam Hussein, Stalin, Hitler and their ilk for our safety, instead of their fear of our strength, is flawed, and history has clearly shown this idea to have failed, time and time again. I do have faith in the brave men and women who help defend this idea of ours,this nation, and know that they will never allow us to become helpless underthe greedy ambitions of any despot who thinks he has an advantage over us and is willing to gamble his peoples safety, and our lives, for his own gain." Frankly, these people scare the hell out of me: Can you image if someone like this were elected US President? Unilateral disarmament, and I dont think they will stop at nukes. We should reply upon leaders like those of North Korea, Iran, and all future despots to *not* take advantage of their having a nuclear club to wield agaisnt our now unarmed nation??? God help us if these people ever gain power here. NewGuy
 
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Vulture    anti-war people are also anti rational.   1/10/2004 5:01:35 PM
Thanks for the excerpts. I would point out that if the US unilaterally disarmed itself, seccession would be most popular pastime for the states. Never mind that there are already plans for seizing nuclear weapons from nearby air force bases in case of secession. So the actually disarmament would be creating more "nuclear states" in the club.
 
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Thomas    RE:anti-war people are also anti rational.   2/17/2004 6:39:31 AM
In the bad old day when I was a student I lived in a student hostel where a lot of commies and other leftwing fringe personalities lived. I was told when the revolution came, I would be taken out and shot. I said: "OK, but then I'll take as many of you with me as I can." Astonished the female asked: "Even if it us coming to get You." Right then and there I decided it was time to put up an appearence on a regular basis on the firing range.
 
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sentinel28a    RE:anti-war people are also anti rational.   2/17/2004 2:45:13 PM
I live in a bastion of that thought. People are amazed to find that military men--rational ones, anyway--are against war. A Vietnam veteran was asked why the military hated war so much, yet was willing to fight in them. He said, "Because we're the ones who will pay with our lives, not you, and because we realize that occasionally good men die to keep other good men free." I always point out the example of a democracy that slashed military spending to the bone and refused to develop even advanced defensive armament until it was too late. That country is named France, and it paid for its mistake with four years of brutal occupation. Kennedy knew what he was talking about when he said "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance."
 
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Phoenix Rising    RE:anti-war people are also anti rational.   2/21/2004 10:54:40 AM
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." (John Stuart Mill) Always one of my favorites. This thread made me think of it. --Phoenix Rising
 
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