Military History
|
How To Make War
|
Wars Around the World
Rules of Use
How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Air Defense
Discussion Board
Return to Topic Page
Subject:
ASTOR v Standard
kensohaski
2/19/2008 7:15:12 AM
I would like to see some current discussion on the capabilities of each...
Quote
Reply
Show Only Poster Name and Title
Newest to Oldest
B.Smitty
2/19/2008 8:24:14 AM
ASTOR
is an airborne radar system.
If you mean
ASTER
, the missile system, then there are other threads on this board that go in to significant detail about this.
Quote
Reply
kensohaski
2/20/2008 12:54:20 PM
I was talking about the ground mapping radar. I guess it is pretty good.....
Quote
Reply
B.Smitty
2/20/2008 4:05:43 PM
ASTOR vs what then?
The only "Standard" I can think of is the
Standard
missile system. Obviously one can not directly compare a sea-based SAM system with an airborne ground-mapping radar.
Quote
Reply
B.Smitty
2/20/2008 4:10:55 PM
A friendly word of advice: You'll get a lot more interest in your topic if you first research the systems you would like to discuss, and then as ask pointed questions or make detailed observations.
Asking for other people to just "discuss" something will likely lead to a dead thread.
Quote
Reply
kensohaski
2/20/2008 6:58:35 PM
Lol,
I have been around here for a little while guys.. Ease up.. Ya'll knew what I meant.
I got the two systems confused. I was told mistakenly that ASTOR was an AEW system. I did some reading and I guess it is a ground radar like our JSTAR.
I will read about ASTER as well..
Quote
Reply
dwightlooi
3/1/2008 1:14:56 PM
From a capabilities stand point, the Standard + Mk41 (or Mk57) system is superior to the Aster + Sylver VLS even though the European system is a more recent development and has certain features the US system lacks.
Range
The Aster system has significantly shorter range than the Standard. It is also relies exclusively on 2-stage designs which hampers the miminum range of the short range Aster 15 because maneuvering is limited until the 1st stage booster has been jettisoned. The following is a comparison of the two. The ESSM is thrown in because it is the horizon range missile used by AEGIS ships and is fired from the same VLS as the Standard.
Aster 15 (2-stage) -- Mach 3.5, 30km
Aster 30 (2-stage) -- Mach 4.5, 120km
ESSM (1-stage) -- Mach 4+, 50km
Standard SM-2MR (1-stage) --Mach 3.5+, 167km
Standard SM-2ER or SM-6 (2-stage) -- Mach 3.5+, 370km
Standard SM-3 (3-stage, exoatmospheric) -- Mach 9+, 600 km; ballistic only
Guidance
The main distinction of the Aster over the ESSM/Standard is that it currently uses active radar homing for terminal guidance. This eliminates the need for radar illumination and/or the possibility of illuminator saturation on ships without multiple illuminators or X-band ESA multimode radars. Active homing also opens up the possibility of engaging targets on under the radar horizon assuming that a remote sensor track is available and can be communicated.
Aster 15 -- Active Radar
Aster 30 -- Inertial Command + Terminal Active Radar
ESSM -- Inertial Command + Terminal Semi-Active Radar
Standard SM-2MR Block IIIB -- Inertial Command + Terminal Dual Band (Semi-active Radar & Imaging IR)
Standard SM-2ER Block IV -- Intertial Command + Terminal Semi-Active Radar
Standard SM-6 -- Intertial & GPS Command + Terminal Active Radar
Standard SM-3 -- Inertial & GPS Command + Terminal Imaging IR
Control and Agility
The Aster system utilizes lateral control jets for terminal divert control in additional to tail mounted aerodynamic controls. This permits two things. Extreme altitude maneuvering and steering speed/precision for hit-to-kill. Unfortunately, the Aster system (until the on-paper Aster 45 is developed and deployed) lacks the kinematics to that really requires lateral divert control for maneuvering. The X-band active seeker on the Aster missiles also lack the resolution needed to prosecute hit-to-kill as the primary neutralization mechanism -- to do that a millimeter wave imaging radar or imaging IR guidance is necessary. Nonetheless, the Aster is hit-to-kill "ready" if an appropriate seeker is incorporated. Until then, the 15kg blast fragmentation serves up the kill even if the aster misses by a feet or several.
The ESSM and Standard SM-2 missiles rely on traditional tail steered aerodynamic controls. This limits the operational altitude to ~24km (only the ER is designed to go that high) and maneuvering precision. This means that the weapon is has to rely on explosive blast fragmentation as the primary kill mechanism. To this end, they carry much bigger warheads than the Aster family. 39kg on the ESSM and 61 kg on the SM-2/6.
The SM-3 is a completely different animal. The SM-3 replaces the entire warhead and guidance section of the SM-2 block IV with a third stage. This ignites at about 25km altitude and takes the weapon out of the atmosphere. At about 80km altitude, the nose cone is jettisoned and a kinetic energy kill vehicle is exposed. A powerful IR telescope acquires the target and if necessary a second pulse is ignited to push the missile even higher (up to >280km altitude if necessary). As it closes on the target, the kill vehicle is released and the third stage falls away. Eight lateral divert jets and two axial pulse motors refines the aim until the kill vehicle slams into the incoming ballistic missile in space at an altitude between 100 and 250km and out to about 600km down range.
Flexibility
This is one area where the Aster-Sylver system lags. As of today, the system is exclusively a SAM VLS. The Mk41 on the other hand also handles the Tomahawk TACTOM (cruise missile) and the ASROC anti-submarine torpedo delivery rocket.
Quote
Reply
Latest
News
Most
Read
Most
Commented
Hot
Topics
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: Ukrainian Improvised Air-Defense Network
AIR DEFENSE: Where the Patriot Missile Batteries Are
AIR DEFENSE: Never Enough Air Defense Missiles
SUBMARINES: US Colombia SSBNs Behind Schedule
PROCUREMENT: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
PROCUREMENT: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
CHINA: China April 2024 Update
SUBMARINES: New Submarines for Norway
WEAPONS: Russia Running Out of Antique Weapons
SOMALIA: Somalia April 2024
ARTILLERY: New Iranian Weapons
INTELLIGENCE: NATO Suspects a Threat
ATTRITION: Russia fires on Ukrainian Fakes
NAVAL AIR: Tritons Assemble
WEAPONS: South Korean Arms Exports to the Middle East
LIBYA: Libya April Update
ARTILLERY: Russia Bombards Ukraine With North Korean Missiles
WARPLANES: South Korea’s Troubled KF-21 Jet Fighter Project
AIR WEAPONS: Drones Dominate Ukrainian Battlefield
SUBMARINES: Ukraine Obtains Anti-Submarine Weapons
MURPHY'S LAW: Nationwide Impact of Ukraine War in Russia
STRATEGIC WEAPONS: American ARRW Missile Tested
SURFACE FORCES : Vasily Bykov class Corvettes
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: Tatar Rebels in Crimea
PROCUREMENT: China Supercharges Military Spending
ARMOR: M1A2SEP3 Tank Paradox
AIR DEFENSE: Russia Seeks Answers
ARTILLERY: HIMARS Prevails Against Russians
ARTILLERY: Chinese-Truck Mounted Artillery
SURFACE FORCES : Zumwalt Class Destroyers Find a Purpose
Subscribe to Our RSS Feed
Air Defense: Where the Patriot Missile Batteries Are
Special Operations: Ukrainian Improvised Air-Defense Network
Special Operations: Ukrainian Improvised Air-Defense Network
Air Defense: Never Enough Air Defense Missiles
Submarines: US Colombia SSBNs Behind Schedule
WARS China: China April 2024 Update
Weapons: Russia Running Out of Antique Weapons
Procurement: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
Procurement: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
Submarines: New Submarines for Norway
On PointIsrael's Airspace Defense Victory: Credit Reagan's SDI
Artillery: New Iranian Weapons
Intelligence: NATO Suspects a Threat
WARS Somalia: Somalia April 2024
Naval Air: Tritons Assemble
Attrition: Russia fires on Ukrainian Fakes
WEAPONS: Russia Running Out of Antique Weapons
AIR DEFENSE: Where the Patriot Missile Batteries Are
CHINA: China April 2024 Update
SUBMARINES: New Submarines for Norway
WEAPONS: South Korean Arms Exports to the Middle East
NAVAL AIR: Tritons Assemble
ATTRITION: Russia fires on Ukrainian Fakes
INTELLIGENCE: NATO Suspects a Threat
ARTILLERY: New Iranian Weapons
SOMALIA: Somalia April 2024
PROCUREMENT: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
PROCUREMENT: Neutral Switzerland Upgrades Its Military
SUBMARINES: US Colombia SSBNs Behind Schedule
AIR DEFENSE: Never Enough Air Defense Missiles
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: Ukrainian Improvised Air-Defense Network
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: Ukrainian Improvised Air-Defense Network
FORCES: Israeli Haredi Riots
PROCUREMENT: The American Arms Pipeline to Israel
Air Defense: Where the Patriot Missile Batteries Are
News
How To Make War
Wars Around The World
Austin Bay's On Point
StrategyTalk
Dirty Little Secrets
Features
Al Nofi's CIC
Videos
Photos
Jokes
Community
Military Discussion Boards
Military Jokes
Military Photos
Military Book Reviews
StrategyPage
Account Manager
Login
Feedback
About Us
Search
Advertise With Us
Search