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Subject: 2009 displays of the F-22 and the Rafale
Bluewings12    6/24/2009 5:03:48 PM
Let 's watch them first :-) The F-22 h*tp://www.air-attack.com/videos/single/cAhL7lJCk4I The Rafale : h*tp://www.dailymotion.com/user/ministeredeladefense/video/x9ma8h_demonstration-du-rafale_news Both aircrafts are pulling nice stuff . Rafale only does it twice faster . Explaination and details to follow . Cheers .
 
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le_corsaire    To Herald ...   6/26/2009 2:40:51 AM
Very good and detailed explanation ... Thanks
 
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le_corsaire    To Herald ...   6/26/2009 2:53:13 AM




Can anybody tell me why you are that much freaking out about BWs posts ? I am certainly not the "aircraft expert" you guys obviously are, but what your problem - just a guy coming along and saying that in his opinion the Rafale has a comparable or maybe better maneuverability than the F22 ? I rad your posts and in almost every second post there are words like "Troll", "Liar", "Idiot" ... are these your arguments ? hey, if you "know what you ve got" - just stay relaxed ...

 

Maybe you're not reading what all the rest on here are from BW. And I am relaxed. Maybe you are unfamiliar with :-) Thats called a smiley face. Or LOL That's called *laughing out loud*. All signs of being relaxed. Duhhh ;-))))))))))))))))))))))))




However, I also don't find it very appealing if you produce a superior aircraft, which is however so expensive that you can't afford to buy a large enough number to further guarantee your air superiority. Is this success ? I don't know. 

 

And you think the US will not maintain it's air superiority with whatever number of F22's we wind up with? Unlike France, we have more then one egg in our basket. Some of us just prefer to have more of that particualr egg is all. But either way, we will still maintain an absolute air superiority wherever we may choose to fight.  So, are you BW's cousin or what? ;-))) Seeeeeeeee, all relaxed dude. hahaha hehehe hohoho

 

Beazz



 



 



 









Wow, hehehee and hahaha - and "we will always be the superior power of the world" ... seems to me that your posts are not significantly different in quality as Bluewings - right ? Listen Kiddie, fortunate for you your military leaders seem to see situations in a realistic way - maintaining superiority is not only a matter of technology but also a matter of money.
 
I am a ground guy. So please execuse me if I am asking to get qualified answers (like Heralds) in areas where I do not have first hand informatio - however I do not think that I have to be associated with BW or anybody else just I have a French name, especially not by a kiddie who probably never has gotten his ass off his warm couch. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


 
 
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le_corsaire    To Beazz ...   6/26/2009 2:54:23 AM
Sorry ... the header of the last post was wrong
 
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Das Kardinal       6/26/2009 8:41:11 AM
I wonder what BW expected with such a thread <rolleyes>

Anyway, Herald got me curious with his mentions of the D520 and Dunkerque-class BBs. More so as I've only read good things about those before. 
 
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Herald12345       6/26/2009 8:53:11 AM

I wonder what BW expected with such a thread <rolleyes>




Anyway, Herald got me curious with his mentions of the D520 and Dunkerque-class BBs. More so as I've only read good things about those before. 

D-520 defects.

Aircraft engine, air frame, wing chord, absolute performance limits. Only good thing about that design was the aircraft armament. The fact that the Grumman Wildcat tore it apart in the air should tell you something.
 
Dunkerque, main armament quad mount was defective and badly laid out. AAA defense was a joke, propulsion plant defective, armor protection, her best feature, was poorly thought out being poor against dive bomber air attack, (same defect as was the Yamato, the float bubble was not well enough subdivided, nor was shock mounting well thought out)  Fire controil was very inferior to both Italian and German referent enemies.
 
Just off the top of my head you understand........... 
   
   
 
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earlm    Questions for Herald   6/26/2009 11:37:50 AM
Don't want to threadjack but these threads always seem to evolve into more than just the Rafale.
 
I know the Dunkerque class was fatally flawed because they used face hardened armor on the turret roofs but what were the problems with the D520 fighter and the Richelieu class?  Most observers think highly of both.
 
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Herald12345       6/26/2009 12:36:25 PM

Don't want to thread jack but these threads always seem to evolve into more than just the Rafale.

 

I know the Dunkerque class was fatally flawed because they used face hardened armor on the turret roofs but what were the problems with the D520 fighter and the Richelieu class?  Most observers think highly of both.

What observers? The sailors of the USS Massachusetts thought of  Jean Bart after they boarded her that she was a piece of junk-especially the engines...
 
http://polyticks.com/bbma/new/jeanbart/bowhit.jpg" width="432" height="298" /> 
 
http://polyticks.com/bbma/new/jeanbart/afthit2.jpg" width="432" height="276" /> 
 
http://polyticks.com/bbma/new/jeanbart/afthit.jpg" width="432" height="264" /> 
 
Jean Bart after the Massachussetts hit her five times.
 
As for the D-520 that aircraft had a nasty habit of not being able to hold a turn snapping out of control and refusing to point in the turn, no matter how much aeleron and rudder correct was applied. That is known as an EXPLOIT which Luftwaffe pilots gleefully used.

 
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Basilisk Station       6/26/2009 3:47:38 PM
Clearly there is only one choice for resolving this.
 
The US needs to declare war on France, so we can have some F-22 slam some Rafales around like ping pong balls.
 
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JFKY    Oh Great and what    6/26/2009 4:01:43 PM
would we do with all those French PoW's?  And do the French ahve enough white flags?
 
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Rufus       6/26/2009 4:28:29 PM
"The US needs to declare war on France, so we can have some F-22 slam some Rafales around like ping pong balls."
 
That is what is so stupid about all of this.  It is about nothing but some ignorant truck driver's misguided pride.  There isn't even a remote chance the US is going to fight France, and there is only the tiniest of chances they will ever even need to consider fighting a Rafale.
 
IF we somehow ended up fighting an export customer of the Rafale it would never be in a way that would satisfy anyone.  The days of aerial jousting in full view of the Western Front have been gone for nearly 100 years now.  We would shower the country in question with every kind of precision stand-off weapon in our arsenal.  We would jam the heck out of every radar and radio in the country.  We would fight with overwhelming numerical superiority and the best trained and most experienced personnel in the world.  In short, it wouldn't be a fair fight. 
 
Rather than just accepting that his country has built a very good aircraft that reportedly fits their requirements, bluewings insists on trying to "prove" that the Rafale is something it just isn't.  When he can't win an argument with facts or knowledge, he just lies, or repeats stupid myths over and over again.
 

 
 
 
 
 
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