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Subject: How do most Brits feel about the US?
gcw1995    6/8/2005 4:55:35 PM
How do most Brits feel about US government and Americans in general. Here in America, most americans really look at the british as americas only true friend in time of crisis.
 
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AlbanyRifles    Yimmy   6/9/2005 11:24:05 AM
"and have little respect for your military machine. Why is that?" **** Due to various things, such as what comes across to me as a "shoot first ask questions later", attitude. Also their scruffyness, and apparant lack of discipline. Most of my opinion is just formed on news reports, and footage from Iraq, however I also know of a US National Guard soldier, a nice bloke, but the state of his uniform in pictures he showd me of him around camp would have got me a rollocking over here. My only personal experice with American soldiers is again with National Guard, and individualy they were good guys, but their walking into a bar full of soldiers from different nationalities, and trying to get everyone to sing I think the American national amthem was a tad ludicrous. I think a lot of Americas problems military wise are due to a lack of career soldiers, and a high turnover of college kids trying to pay for their education. **** Okay, so your opinion of the entire 1.8 million strong US Armed forces is based on watching TV and looking at 1 US National Guard soldier? And we don't have much of a wordly view? All of this from a 19 year old Territorial? Please! I could see a valid compaint about a specific unit (the one the Guard soldier belongs to), but that is hardly a valid sample size. Still, if that is how you formed your opinion, fine, that is your opinion and you are welcome to it. As for the "wordly view" of Americans, this is something I hear a lot. While there is some validity this is not a true picture. The US is faitly young country and it is huge! It is 3000 miles by 1500 miles. I am 46 years old, have lived over seas, travel extensively and there are 17 states I still haven't visited. There is a lot to see here in the US, so people naturally look to what is happening in our country more than looking overseas.....because for most Americans their entire life is lived within this country. The UK, sitting as it does next to Europe, allows for a population which is more cosmopolitan in Birmingham, UK versus Birmingham, Alabama. Just one little stat from 65 years ago which may show how far the US has come in a such a short period of time......of the soldiers inducted into the US Army in 1940-1942, over 30% got their first indoor plumbing when they entered the service.
 
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Yimmy    RE:Yimmy   6/9/2005 12:16:47 PM
No need to get tetchy Albany. I can only base an opinion on what I know. How else are opinions formed?
 
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Lawman    RE:Yimmy   6/9/2005 12:21:41 PM
"of the soldiers inducted into the US Army in 1940-1942, over 30% got their first indoor plumbing when they entered the service." Yes, it is now down to 20%! Only kidding. The US Army is, from what I have seen, very good, and respond well to the threats they face. I think they get a very bad reputation in the UK media, who seem to think that firing back is wrong, unless you happen to be guaranteed of only hitting the guy firing back at you. The UK military is very egotistical, full of the 'we are the best trained, best equipped' line. This is just patently absurd, the UK armed forces are actually quite poorly equipped, it is only good training that offsets this. The US Army is much larger, and quite well equipped, but sometimes lacks some of the 'reserve' of the UK troops. This is not a bad thing, it is only different - in N. Ireland, if British troops fired back in military-style, the whole place would have been literally a war-zone. Equally, if British troops were deployed in Baghdad, and acted like they do in Basra, the British forces would be shot to pieces.
 
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The Lizard King    Hey man with no name....... Al Qaeda's New Front   6/9/2005 12:51:58 PM
"You might not be able to see it now but look in 10-20 years where France and some parts of Europe will me the next fighting ground for terrorism." Many do see it and this said many are often dumbfounded by the reaction of our Allies with regards to the war on terror. Frontline (PBS) put together an excellent piece on this very subject "Al Qaeda's New Front". http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/front/ If you are not familiar with Frontline, please note this show is world renowned. AFTER 9-11 various Senior Officals (one such person being the very Queen of England) requested a copy of a piece Frontline did on bin laden BEFORE 9-11. http://www.changemakers.net/library/temp/washpost10.16.01.cfm http://www.klru.org/column/archives/nov_01.asp http://energycommerce.house.gov/107/hearings/07102002Hearing622/Mitchell1053.htm
 
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AlbanyRifles    RE:Yimmy   6/9/2005 1:21:34 PM
And that is why I said what I said....you can not form a valid opinion of the entire US Armed Forces based on interface with one National Guard soldier. Just like my opinion of Brits is not based on the thug who tried to break into my rental car in a car park outside of London.
 
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interestedamateur    RE:How do most Brits feel about US?   6/9/2005 1:44:30 PM
Just a few points: F22 - I used the word "fear" because after 9/11 President Bush made it clear that he was prepared to strike unilaterally against terrorism - quite understandably so (I would want Mr Blair to attack terrorists who crashed planes into Canary Wharf for example). I think before this the US was more multi-lateral and less aggressive, or at least seen as such in the UK. When you consider the power of the US, I think fear is an appropriate word! I did say in my original comment that this was merely my opinion, and I'm happy for others to differ/prove me wrong. We Brits are extremely proud of our Army - statistics show it as one of our most respected institutions. Despite the fact that many people here disagree with GW2, no one has criticised the army at any stage (apart from concerning some torture/humiliation of prisoners, which the general staff quickly stopped). Because of this pride we tend to disparage the US Army, without understanding that it works differently. Yimmy, the US armed forces are awesome - look at some of the battle reports from GW1 and GW2. Don't let the fact that they appear to be less disciplined or smart blind you to their intrinsic power and professionalism. I can also send you a link to a FCS paper on the AUSA website; they will be so far ahead of everyone else when this comes into service (even compared to FRES which fundamentally doesn't have the budget that FCS does) it's ridiculous.
 
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metalbanger    RE:How do most Brits feel about US?   6/9/2005 2:16:30 PM
I think most brits like the US their is enough US tv over here to show that, the US life is one which is aspired to. GW2 has pushed a small wedge, and I believe partly media pushed, between us. Myself, i think the US is great, i had a great time in new york, i made a point in going over about 6 months after 911 (and prices were great). I have more in common with you yanks than the french or spanish. But like all things you have your faults, i have met many americans and some seem dismissive of all that is not american. On another board i had a long running chat with a yank as to why i would want to live in the country of my birth and not the US, he could just not understand why i was not on the first plane over. I think your news media is poor especialy FOX. Also you will never match a good English pub lunch with freinds. On the whole i realy like the US and most of those in its borders.
 
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JIMF    Linguistic Differences   6/9/2005 7:18:03 PM
I remember a couple of years back a fellow from the London office of the company I was working at came to our Los Angeles headquarters. Early one morning shortly after his arrival he said that he had to meet with the CFO, I said "be careful he's really pissed" he responded "really, at this time of the morning" I said "I think that guy wakes up pissed" We soon sorted out that in American "pissed" is angry, and in English English it means drunk
 
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F22    RE:How do most Brits feel about the US?--Yimmy   6/9/2005 7:53:37 PM
Yimmy---and have little respect for your military machine. F22---Why is that? Yimmy---Due to various things, such as what comes across to me as a "shoot first ask questions later", attitude. Also their scruffyness, and apparant lack of discipline. You were speaking wrt the individual soldier? What about the US military as a whole and its ability to fight? Yimmy---I also find that Americans come across a tad indoctrinated where it comes to foreign affairs F22---what do you mean by "indoctrinated"?" Yimmy---Indoctrinated may have been a harsh word to use, but that is how I see it. I see it like this because of the way Americans have their flag in every class-room and every morning have the school sware an oath of allegiance. Are you suggesting that Americans tend to believe what they are told instead of applying critical thinking to develop their own views?
 
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F22    RE:How do most Brits feel about the US?--IA   6/9/2005 8:03:12 PM
F22 - I used the word "fear" because after 9/11 President Bush made it clear that he was prepared to strike unilaterally against terrorism - quite understandably so (I would want Mr Blair to attack terrorists who crashed planes into Canary Wharf for example). I think before this the US was more multi-lateral and less aggressive, or at least seen as such in the UK. When you consider the power of the US, I think fear is an appropriate word! I appreciate your response, but I think you are somewhat begging the question. Let me try to be a little more specific. What exactly do the British have to fear from US military power, and our willingness to use it pre-emptively and, if necessary, unilaterally? Do you fear an incompetant President dragging the UK into a wider, bloodier war? Do you fear an insane President declaring the UK a member of the Axis of Evil and attacking? Or do you fear terrorist retaliation against the UK because of US actions? What are your concerns?
 
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