Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
The French "Union" Discussion Board
   Return to Topic Page
Subject: is Paris burning?
EW3    10/26/2006 11:02:00 AM
Any word from people on the streets of France on this?? http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/10/26/D8L0BRT80.html Youths Torch Buses Around Paris Oct 26 9:53 AM US/Eastern By CECILE BRISSON Associated Press Writer PARIS Youths forced passengers off three buses and set them on fire overnight in suburban Paris, raising tensions Thursday ahead of the first anniversary of the riots that engulfed France's rundown, heavily immigrant neighborhoods. No injuries were reported, but worried bus drivers refused to enter some suburbs after dark, and the prime minister urged a swift, stern response. The riots in October 2005 raged through housing projects in suburbs nationwide, springing in part from anger over entrenched discrimination against immigrants and their French-born children, many of them Muslims from former French colonies in Africa. Despite an influx of funds and promises, disenchantment still thrives in those communities. About 10 attackers _ five of them with handguns _ stormed a bus in Montreuil east of Paris early Thursday and forced the passengers off, the RATP transport authority said. They then drove off and set the bus on fire. Late Wednesday, three attackers forced passengers off another bus in Athis-Mons, south of Paris, and tossed a Molotov tail inside, police officials said. The driver managed to put out the fire. Elsewhere, between six and 10 youths herded passengers off a bus in the western suburb of Nanterre late Wednesday and set it alight. Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin said the events "should lead to an immediate response." "We cannot accept the unacceptable," he told reporters in the northern suburb of Cergy-Pontoise. "There will be arrests. ... That is our responsibility." Villepin also said efforts should be directed to "revitalize" troubled neighborhoods, and repeated the government's insistence that authorities rid France of "lawless zones" where youth gangs operate. The overnight attacks and recent ambushes on police have raised concern about the changing character of suburban violence, which is seemingly more premeditated than last year's spontaneous outcry and no longer restricted to the housing projects. The use of handguns was unusual _ last year's rioters were armed primarily with crowbars, stones, sticks or gasoline bombs. Regional authorities said the Nanterre bus line, which passes near Paris' financial district, had not been considered at a high risk of attack. Francois Saglier, director of bus service at the RATP, said the attacks happened "without prior warning and not necessarily in neighborhoods considered difficult." The RATP was to meet later Thursday with unions to determine which routes would be changed or limited in response to the unrest. Unions demanded that the RATP allow drivers to exercise their right to stop work in case of imminent danger. "We will take measures that become necessary to avoid sensitive neighborhoods," Saglier told reporters. The drivers feel "worry but at the same time a great sense of responsibility," he said. The transit authority in the Essonne region south of Paris on Wednesday suspended nighttime bus service for security reasons following "multiple incidents," including a tear gas bomb. France's inability to better integrate minorities and recent violence against police are becoming major political issues as the campaign heats up for next year's presidential and parliamentary elections. Defense Minister Michele Alliot-Marie, who is considering whether to run for president, said that attacks demonstrate "a desire to kill." "Some individuals are looking for provocations, and sometimes go further," she said on i-Tele television. She acknowledged people facing unemployment and living in overcrowded housing projects "have trouble finding their place" in society. The three weeks of riots were sparked by the deaths on Oct. 27, 2005, of two young boys of African descent who were electrocuted in a power substation in Clichy-sous-Bois, northeast of Paris, while hiding from police.
 
Quote    Reply

Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest
Herc the Merc    The Parisians promote this   10/26/2006 11:54:32 AM
A French Moslem from that neighbourhood cannot get a job, I think the hostility is similar to Israelis not renting or hiring arabs-EW3 its hard for you to conceptualize since that feeling doesn't exist in the US except civilian airport lobbies.  French mainstream and interior minister like "Sakarosky" etc get the blame. By and large I have met many Moslems from Palestinians to rich Saudis, Iranians to Indonesians--as a rule they are the usual people we meet everyday.
 
Quote    Reply

Danton74       10/26/2006 8:46:00 PM
I can't understand the fixation with trying to make this an issue of religion... the article says "many of whom are muslim" - I can't help but wonder why!
 
Quote    Reply

Claymore       10/29/2006 3:42:42 AM
Why does the french media call a spade a spade and stop this "YOUTH" BS. They are unassimilated Muslim immigrat classes that violently disrespect French Law. This represents a failure of multiculturalism.

Further down the road France will either be one of two things.
1. a Muslim Theocratic State
2. a Fascist anti-immigrat state driving these hoards out.

Looking back at French History you will see that these people have demostrated Xenophobic and Brutal Behavior. There is hope that they will come to their senses and solve this.

I heard 6,000 injuries have been reported by police due to incidents with the "Youths"

 
Quote    Reply

Danton74       10/29/2006 5:52:41 AM
Claymore - I can't help but laugh at your xenophobic brain-washing. What you've just written is utter bullshit but since you know better I won't try to "discuss" it with you.
 
Quote    Reply

Nanheyangrouchuan       10/29/2006 4:02:18 PM
I just love how the Europeans scold us for our lack of "multicultarism" and yet we have no problem with any of our immigrant populations rising up in anger due to institutionalized descrimination and ghettos.
 
Quote    Reply

Claymore       10/29/2006 4:42:49 PM
Come on Danton. Have you learned anything from French History?

You are either Denying that France has a Huge Problem with a ring of Hostile unassimilate Muslim immigrants....Sorry I mean "youths"....every country has "youths" right? lol France's biggest mistake is that these people ARE FRENCH CITIZENS. You cannot deport these thugs. they are violent and resent anything traditional about how France is run. You will either submit to their demands or have to fight back. France has a history of doing both things, it will be intersting to see.

 
Quote    Reply

Danton74       10/29/2006 8:07:01 PM

I just love how the Europeans scold us for our lack of "multicultarism" and yet we have no problem with any of our immigrant populations rising up in anger due to institutionalized descrimination and ghettos.
Yeah, look, I wouldn't start preaching to me about what Europeans think. This thread is about France not "European multiculturalism", if that's what you're looking to discuss you should head to the UK board since multiculturalism is their bright idea not ours. And if you cared to check you would note that the UK has had more violent rioting by minorities than France, but do I see many stupid threads titled "Is xxxxx British town burning"? No .... I wonder why.

Now, I don't particularly want to get into a slanging match with you but I can't let the following "untruth" stand unchallenged " we have no problem with any of our immigrant populations rising up in anger due to institutionalized descrimination and ghettos"... Really? I'm sure I recall that the US does have some pretty substantial racial tensions to deal with but perhaps your memory fails you so I'll leave you to think on some of the following:

 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_incidents_of_civil_unrest_in_the_United_States


I don't deny there are problems in parts of France with disenfranchised people taking to the street sometimes in completely unacceptably violent fashion - but you know that's our problem to deal with. The facts remain that these are poor people from a broad range of backgrounds: white, black, brown, athetists, christian, catholic, muslim, jewish NOT just "mainly muslims" as is constantly portrayed and propagandized by some. So let me repeat POOR is the key word not religion.
 
Quote    Reply

Danton74       10/29/2006 8:31:02 PM

Come on Danton. Have you learned anything from French History?

You are either Denying that France has a Huge Problem with a ring of Hostile unassimilate Muslim immigrants....Sorry I mean "youths"....every country has "youths" right? lol France's biggest mistake is that these people ARE FRENCH CITIZENS. You cannot deport these thugs. they are violent and resent anything traditional about how France is run. You will either submit to their demands or have to fight back. France has a history of doing both things, it will be intersting to see.


I'm not denying France has a problem with unemployed youths - that you have right. I am denying that, in your words, France has a Huge Problem with a ring of Hostile unassimilated Muslim immigrants - in fact I disagree with every nuance of your allegation.
Firstly, they are not hostile nor unassimilated: they are angry at not being able to find jobs (not that that is a good excuse to riot), and they are far from being unassimilated since they are French, and are considered so by everyone other than nutbags like Le Pen.
Your xenophobia comes shining through with "France's biggest mistake is that these people are French... you can't deport these thugs" Damned that's shocking. We don't want to deport them at all, only the Neo-nazi types want that kind of garbage. Like I said, they're French, we consider them to be French, and they're staying and the vast majority of French want that.

"They are violent" - Well, clearly some are - I guess the majority in work and doing well doesn't make for good TV news ratings in some quarters.

"and resent anything traditional about how France is run" - That's a gem, where did you get that? Oh, yes, these people are muslim fanatics aren't they, so what they want is to turn France into a muslim theocracy, right? Nutjob.
 
Quote    Reply

Claymore       10/30/2006 12:02:33 AM
Who would you say are the Leaders of their communities?
 
Quote    Reply



 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics