Didn't mean to sound as if I approveds or that I thought it was the right thing. I think their training was more suited to what 3 ID in Mar 03 than what you guys were doing. As we have both said here many times...soldiers are the products of their training. That said, they are better trained now and are doing a much better job.

I guarantee you that the conversation heard between the pilot and gunner was on intercom.......and it would have sounded the same in a Warrior, Bradley, BMP-2, Lynx, or any other vehicle or air crew under combat conditions. All of that said, that battalion commander was, rightly, relieved of command. The instances of friendly fire are both ancient and are mitagatable through training, rehearsals and planning.....but they can never be totally prevented.

"I guarantee you that the conversation heard between the pilot and gunner was on intercom" Well you are wrong there. They were speaking on the net, including to their bat commander.

Yimmy, Hate to break it to you, but much of what you heard was IC (intercom) vice FM or UHF. Go to the link of the report that listed a few posts back, and at the end, you'll find the transcript of the comms, and it lists whether it was IC, FM, or UHF.

AR, I didn't take it to mean that you concurred with their approach to COIN, but I see that the old adage "silence is consent" bothered you enough to bring you back to the topic to write your disclaimer ;)

>>Well you are wrong there. They were speaking on the net, including to their bat commander.<< In the particular case in question with the Apaches back in 1991, the battalion commander was inside the aircraft . . .

"In the particular case in question with the Apaches back in 1991, the battalion commander was inside the aircraft . . ." Ahh, that could have been what made me think they were talking over the net.

So, as I said, intercom communications between a crew are usually much more colorful than radio traffic. As I remember you are a TA infantryman? I am sure your discussions amongst your section mates is considerably more strident an dcoloful than what you report over the radio? Same thing with aircraft and vehicle crews. That said, I am not sticking up for the battalion commander....he was in the wrong from the start...never should have been in the pit.

Easy there, Padawan.....respect your elders....especially if you want some log staff work done!!!!

your point about the dismounts potentially having a manpad is well taken. i don't know how freely the iraqis handed those out to their guys but it's certainly a factor to consider. actually the thing that bothered me the most about the whole little piece was the sheer glee after they hit the warriors. it was much like kids playing a vid game and clearing a level in record time or the like.