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Subject: How do Australians really feel about Julian Assange?
Panther    12/6/2010 10:24:25 PM
I don't know if this is stirring up a hornet's nest and i do apologize for this not being related to the military, so please forgive me. But my curiosity has been piqued by an Australian buddy from another forum saying that the Aussie view of him is only positive and lovely? Is this true? I do have a hard time believing that to be the case, but then again, what do i know? I figured i would get a second opinion if it isn't too much trouble or won't stir up any of the same!?
 
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Panther       12/10/2010 10:39:29 PM




How does a "twisted view of women and no understanding of the word 'no' " make him innocent, or them evil feminists? If anything all she said was that no seedy gov. agency was behind it and that she and the other girl took full responsibility for their prosecution.










The term consensual and 'no' are mutually exclusive, if they at any point said no, and he continued, that is rape. Regardless of how consensual previous experiences were.





Before you comment, learn to read the article in the link.



Rather hard to do seeing that the link doesn't work.
 
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Aussiegunneragain       12/11/2010 12:44:41 AM

I am actually appreciative of the info that has come out in reference to Rudd and his stand on China, he has actually gone up in my estimation.  The former US Ambassadors opinion of him concerned me as I started to wonder if the revelations about Rudd that cost him his leader ship were driven from out side of Australia but then when it was revealed that Arbib was considered to be a solid gold source it all made sense.
I don't think that the ALP would boot a sitting PM at the behest of the Americans, too many of them are extremely anti-American and any whiff of that would cause them all to fall in behind him. It was the man's incompetance and personality that was his downfall.
As an aside, one of the biggest favours that Assange has done anybody was to publish the info about how much the Arab leaders want the Iranian nuclear program stopped. I will use that to stop any pinko cheese eaters or radical Islam apologists in their tracks, when they try to tell me about how military action in Iran would destroy any prospect of a strong relationship between the West and the Muslim world.

 
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YelliChink       12/11/2010 2:33:58 AM


Rather hard to do seeing that the link doesn't work.

 
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hairy man       12/11/2010 7:34:29 PM
If Assange has endangered soldiers lives as claimed, that of course shows a lack of common snese on his part and poor judgement.
As for him showing up politicians and governments and now the Banking sector for their  stupidity, poor judgement, and dishonesty, I can see nothing wrong with that.  In fact it is in the public's interest to  be made aware of these things. The only crimes I can see being committed, apart from anything that Wikileaks exposes, has been committed by the government employees that have leaked these documents.  As a journalist Assange may have then believed it was his duty to publish them.  However, a little more common sense should have been displayed.
 
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BoHG       12/12/2010 2:49:59 AM
IMO Assange is a dangerous sociopath, he has admitted responsibility for the deaths of 1300 Kenyans and for rendering 350,000 others homeless, yet writes it off with a "40,000 children a year die of malaria" as being of no consequence.
 
He was also happy to release details of Afghans cooperating with the US in Afghanistan, there will be more deaths there.
Releasing a targeting list for terrorists is also likely to result in casualties.
That "people don't count" attitude is why I believe he is a sociopath and why I find the accusations against him to be credible, IMO if he doesn't get what he wants, he is more than happy to take it.
 
I'm personally alarmed by the fact that he has revealed that China won't back North Korea when they collapse - IMO it is now far more likely that the 'elites' of NK will choose to go out in an NBC blaze of glory when the 'fall of the reich' scenario plays out.
 
I think it is safe to write off the possibility that Assange is a journalist, I believe that he crueled that when his first response to the possibility of legal action was blackmail "you arrest me and we dump the lot on the net", not likely to go down well in any court. It is also worth noting that he has been caught faking his controversy in the past - his "collateral murder" gunship footage was slowed down to give the impression that the Helo crew had plenty of time to make decisions and the guy with the RPG and the one with the AK were edited out to make it look like the US Helo crew deliberately shot up a group of unarmed civilians. It is also worth noting that Wikileaks has been pulling a number of those released documents, redacting information and then quietly replacing them in an attempt to make themselves look like they are acting in a responsible fashion - far too late of course, as that stuff will be getting hoovered up within seconds of posting by intelligence services and terrorists alike.
 
He has a grudge againt the US and is acting it out.
 
Anyone who thinks complete honesty is a good idea in life, let alone diplomacy has never had a female friend ask, "does this make my bum look fat?"  in life honesty there can get you killed, in diplomacy it can get millions killed. So interfering with basic diplomatic processes is simply not sane.
 
It is also worth considering that the secrets he chose to release were not his to release, they belonged to the US people, held for them by their elected representatives, if he felt secrets were so bad, he could have at least made an effort to ask the US people if they wanted their secrets divulged, he didn't, he took it upon himself.
 
To address the original question, how do Australians feel about Assange - In Sydney there was a rally in support of Assange 500 people attended (AAP numbers), in Melbourne I've seen figures of 50-80,000 people turning out to see Oprah Winfrey.
 
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hairy man       12/12/2010 6:05:55 PM
It is also worth considering that the secrets he chose to release were not his to release, they belonged to the US people, held for them by their elected representatives, if he felt secrets were so bad, he could have at least made an effort to ask the US people if they wanted their secrets divulged, he didn't, he took it upon himself.
 
You are forgetting, it is not Assange that is stealing these secrets.  It is American government employees, probably.
 
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BoHG       12/12/2010 6:53:36 PM

You are forgetting, it is not Assange that is stealing these secrets.  It is American government employees, probably.

No, I'm not forgetting that it was Bradley Manning who stole the secrets (I both hope and expect that he will get the death penalty for that), but who stole the secrets has nothing to do with who divulged them.
Assange could have either reported the theft or simply deleted/destroyed the information he got. but he is too desperate to be famous and have the whole world see how clever he is, so it's damn the consequences and release.
 
Ask yourself, if it was your secrets he released, would you feel Assange was in the clear just because he didn't steal it himself, he just profited from the release?
 
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Aussiegunneragain       12/12/2010 9:51:24 PM

It is also worth considering that the secrets he chose to release were not his to release, they belonged to the US people, held for them by their elected representatives, if he felt secrets were so bad, he could have at least made an effort to ask the US people if they wanted their secrets divulged, he didn't, he took it upon himself.

Whether or not the US people want their secrets revealed, apart from those where this has directly threatenned lives, is beside the point. In publishing information that he has recieved, he is exercising free speech. This is protected in the United States by the First Amendment and interenationally by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. The US people can't justifiably seek action against him, other than in the instances where he has directly threatenned lives, when their own system of government rests on his right for him to do what he has done.
 
Incidentally, does everybody here realise that the US Government has been hassling the Australian government about the proposed internet filter for pornography in Australia? Do you know why? You guessed it, they are concerned about the impact that this will have on free speech.
 
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smitty237    All turned around   12/12/2010 10:44:27 PM
I can't believe the number of people that are somehow able to absolve Assange of any kind of guilt on this issue.  A lot of his apologists are quick to point out that it was Bradley Manning that stole the classified information, and not Assange.  This is not in dispute.  Manning is a traitorous little turd, and there is no doubt that punk will spend the rest of his miserable life breaking big rocks into little rocks at Ft. Leavenworth (which is only about twenty miles down the road from my home).  But to claim Assange has no culpabililty for releasing the information or claim he is only exercising free speech is like prosecuting a burglar but refusing to prosecute the guy that knowingly bought the stolen property in the interests of free commerce.  Assange knew that the information was obtained illegally and knew that the information was classified and that it would hurt a lot of people to release it, but he didn't care. 
 
I find it a little humorous that radicals and revolutionaries will crow about free speech and free press.........at least until they gain the power to restrict it.  I would dare say that if Assange and his ilk were somehow able to gain political power they would hold a much dimmer view on criticism of the State or keeping State secrets.  Listen to how they whine when somone hacks into their website. 
 
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BoHG       12/12/2010 11:14:08 PM


Whether or not the US people want their secrets revealed, apart from those where this has directly threatenned lives, is beside the point. In publishing information that he has recieved, he is exercising free speech. This is protected in the United States by the First Amendment and interenationally by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. The US people can't justifiably seek action against him, other than in the instances where he has directly threatenned lives, when their own system of government rests on his right for him to do what he has done.


The US are likely to go after him on espionage charges, he deliberately set up a system to allow the distribution of stolen and classified materials. Under the act he was required to return the classified materials.
The first amendment does not protect espionage. Do you really think that a person publishing details of the manhattan project or D-Day planning in an internationally distributed pamphlet in 1943 would have been protected by the first amendment?
On the bright side, he has also opened himself up to a heap of civil actions by the survivors of people killed by his revelations.
 
 
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