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Subject: White paper orders huge military build-up!!!!!!!!!
Volkodav    4/25/2009 3:36:57 AM
Ummm wow! How accurate is this? Patrick Walters, National security editor | April 25, 2009 Article from: The Australian KEVIN Rudd is set to announce Australia's biggest military build-up since World War II, led by a multi-billion-dollar investment in maritime defence, including 100 new F-35 fighters, a doubling of the submarine fleet, and powerful new surface warships. Play 12345Loading…Please login to rate a video.You can't rate an advertisement.(1 vote) Biggest military boost since WWII Kevin Rudd is set to roll out the biggest military build-up since World War II. 04/09 Sky News Views today: 396Sorry, this video is no longer available.The new defence white paper will outline plans for a fundamental shake-up of Australia's defence organisation to ensure that the nation can meet what the Prime Minister sees as a far more challenging and uncertain security outlook in Asia over the next two decades. China's steadily growing military might and the prospect of sharper strategic competition among Asia's great powers are driving the maritime build-up, which will see new-generation submarines and warships equipped with cruise missiles, and a big new investment in anti-submarine warfare and electronic warfare platforms, including new naval helicopters. The white paper will consider the emerging non-traditional threats to Australia, including cyber security, climate change and its associated risk of large uncontrolled people movements. Senior government sources say Mr Rudd has insisted that defence spending remain largely insulated from the Government's budget difficulties, but the Defence Department will still have to find at least $15 billion of internal savings over the next decade to help pay for the $100 billion-plus long-term equipment plan. Mr Rudd said yesterday the delivery of the white paper was proving "acutely challenging as we work to defend ourselves from the global economic storm". "It is the most difficult environment to frame the Australian budget in modern economic history. It is also the most difficult environment to frame our long-term defence planning in modern economic history as well," he told the Australia-Israel Chamber of Commerce. "Nevertheless the Government will not resile even in the difficult times from the requirement for long-term coherence of our defence planning for the long-term security of our nation. This is core business for government. That is why we have forged ahead in our preparation of the defence white paper because national security needs do not disappear because of the global recession. If anything, those needs become more acute." Funding pressures will mean the navy will not get a fourth air warfare destroyer, and the delivery of the first batch of the RAAF's F-35 joint strike fighters will slip by at least one year to 2014-15. The huge cost of paying for the next-generation defence force, due to be detailed in the white paper and the forthcoming 10-year defence capability plan, will have little impact on the defence budget over the the next four years. Apart from the air warfare destroyers and the F-35 fighters, most of the planned defence purchases will not have to be paid for until well into the next decade and beyond. Mr Rudd and Defence Minister Joel Fitzgibbon are expected to release the long-awaited white paper as early as next week, with the more detailed 10-year defence capability plan due to be published by mid-year. The naval build-up will be led by a planned 12-strong submarine fleet expected to replace the Collins-class boats from 2025. It will enable the RAN to deploy up to seven boats to protect Australia's northern approaches, including key maritime straits running through the Indonesian archipelago, at times of high threat. The white paper will outline the requirement for a new class of eight 7000-tonne warships equipped with ballistic missile defence systems similar to the three air warfare destroyers already on order that will eventually replace the Anzac frigates. A new class of 1500-tonne corvette-size patrol boats able to take a helicopter is slated to replace the Armidale-class vessels from the mid-2020s. The more robust maritime force will also mean the RAAF's veteran AP-3 Orion fleet being replaced with a mix of at least eight P-8 Poseidon long-range surveillance aircraft, together with up to seven unmanned aerial surveillance vehicles, possibly the US-made Global Hawk, operating out of an expanded Edinburgh air base in South Australia. The navy is also expected to acquire up to 27 anti-submarine helicopters. Mr Rudd has foreshadowed the maritime build-up as pointing to the need for Australia to accommodate "huge increases in military spending here in our own region". "If we are going to defend our sea-lines of communication to the rest of the world, we have got to make sure that we have got the naval capability to underpin that. And Australia must therefore
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gf0012-aust       4/25/2009 3:49:05 AM
'tis a bit odd I'd have to say.  

all the indicators are that things are getting cut.  apart from the obvious of canning No: 4, no extra fat ships.

the Spartan substitute was flagged on here 2007 but went into a mobius strip decision making cycle.

as much as I'd like to believe that ADF is getting properly geared up, the proof will have to be in the pudding.  

certainly the geek side of the shop is staying on track....

to paraphrase the "5th Element"... "I have a doubt" on the other apparent "good" news.

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Aussiegunneragain       4/26/2009 1:42:02 AM
So they are going to make a whole lot of long-term plans that they don't actually have to pay for for at least 4 years and that they can back out of if they find other uses for our money in the meantime (like that isn't going to happen under Chairman Rudd and Co). What a good way to sound strong on defence while not actually doing anything concrete!!! The way this mob are going with economic management even before considering the effects of the recession in six to eight years time this country is going to be in the same state as NSW is now, buggered. As such I'm sceptical of the notion that even half of these promises will get funded.
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Volkodav       4/26/2009 4:39:42 AM
Lets wait and see.
Something I find very interesting is the rhetoric from Labor about the "hollow" force they have inherited sounds very similar to what the Liberals were saying in 97.
It was true then and it remains true now the ADF is hollow, always has been and unfortunately may always remain so.
The plan, though short on details, sounds good and has the potential to bring our capabilities up to where they need to be so long as both sides of politics push it through.
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Aussiegunneragain    From the Oz .... read the last line   4/26/2009 9:25:46 AM

KEVIN Rudd wants Australia to be able to exercise more strategic weight in what promises to be a more volatile and dynamic Asia-Pacific region over the next generation.

That means the new defence white paper, expected next week, will be sharply focused on maritime defence and Australia's ability to project naval power further from its northern approaches.

The naval and air power build-up is the key component in a more powerful defence force that the Prime Minister sees as essential to preserving Australia's security in a more turbulent world.

The white paper is the latest manifestation of Rudd's ambition for Australia to be able to act as a significant middle power in the Asia-Pacific region.

It is also a recognition that the power balances in our region are undergoing ahistoric shift with the rise of China and India.

Rudd understands that in a generation's time Beijing's formidably expanding military power could challenge the long-held military dominance of the US in east Asia with destabilising consequences for regional security.

Those familiar with the new white paper say it is carefully focused on regional security trends in keeping with defence doctrine outlined in recent white papers.

But in proposing a larger maritime force, led by 12 powerful submarines, it goes well beyond the more restricted confines of the 2000 white paper brought down by the Howard government.

This will mean spending more, much more, on Australia's defence. Rudd has promised to maintain annual real increases in the defence budget of 3 per cent and Defence has been tasked with finding billions of dollars of savings to fund future equipment needs.

Defence has come under huge pressure to cut its budget even further in the face of the global economic crisis but Rudd has firmly resisted pressure to abandon the 3 per cent pledge.

Luckily for the Government, the big defence bills won't fall due until well after next month's federal budget forward estimates period, which runs to 2013.

Those familiar with the new white paper are impressed with its scope but note that the Rudd Government probably won't be held accountable for the delivery of the promised equipment.

Funding the expanded defence force outlined in the new white paper will require even bigger funding increases than those promised by the Government.

As the late, great defence secretary Arthur Tange once observed, defence strategy without the dollars is not a strategy.
Apart from the fact that this is more bullshit smoke and mirrors from Rudd (like how he said that he was an "economic conservative" before the election), comparing the ADF now to what it was like in 1997 and applying the same terminology of it being a "hollow" force is complete rubbish. The ADF has successfully sustained 10 years of continous operations and has acquired many capabilities that we only dreamed of during the 90's, all due to John Howard's 3 percent per annum real increase in funding. Any "hollowness" that the ADF faces now is reletive to a far more challenging strategic environment rather than being as the result of a decade of neglect as it was under the ALP and their DOA debacle.
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Aussiegunneragain    Uh oh   4/27/2009 6:30:32 AM
See highlighted sections, they all focus on capabilities needed for the deployment of heavy ground forces abroad. Are we being primed for a BIG cut or delay, say to those two big expensive cross beach assets that have yet to be built? It would fit with the failure to mention them in the previous article and Chairman Rudd's apparent focus on assets good for DOA and sea lane control.
"Matthew Franklin, Chief political correspondent | April 27, 2009
Article from:  The Australian

TAXPAYERS face tens of millions of dollars in extra spending commitments because billions have been spent on hi-tech military hardware without the allocation of funds for its maintenance or operations training.

Millions needed to plug gaps in defence,,6598168,00.jpg" width="232" />

The defence white paper will set out a 30-year blueprint for defence, including buying 100 new F-35 fighters

The Rudd Government will use the upcoming release of its defence white paper to highlight what it describes as a chronic lack of proper planning by the Howard government, which it says made at least five big-ticket purchases of hi-tech equipment without budgeting for the associated funding. The white paper, to be released within days, will outline massive spending in "remediation" to fill the funding gaps so the new military assets can be properly used.

As revealed in The Weekend Australian on Saturday, the white paper will set out a 30-year blueprint for defence, including doubling the size of the nation's submarine fleet and buying 100 new F-35 fighters.

The strategy will aim to build Australia's military strength in its region to counter the growth in China's military might, as well as put new focus on non-traditional security concerns such as cyber security and climate.

The paper will take on a political dimension as Labor seeks to highlight administrative deficiencies by the Defence Department under the previous government, which will land taxpayers with major and unavoidable new spending commitments.

For example, the paper will describe how the Howard government's 2007 decision to buy two Landing Helicopter Dock amphibious vessels - each used to transport up to 1000 soldiers, six helicopters and 150 vehicles - came without funding to make necessary upgrading to naval wharves and docks.

The $2 billion price tag did not recognise the need to buy new cranes, forklifts and other wharf equipment necessary to load the vessels, sources said.

The white paper will outline failure to fund training and support services to operate 59 new Abrams tanks, which the Howard government decided to buy in 2004 at a cost of $550 million.

The tanks included complex technology but no spending was allocated to integrate their use with that of other vehicles and existing communications systems, the paper says.

The previous government also did not allocate funding for training in the operation of the tanks.

Kevin Rudd refused to comment on the contents of the white paper yesterday. But in a speech in Melbourne on Friday, the Prime Minister said that while the white paper would chart the nation's defence priorities over coming decades, there were problems with holes in the existing budgeting.

"We'll be faced with challenges concerning the remediation of our existing defence assets - plugging the gap which already exists in the defence force that we've inherited from our predecessors as well as building the defence force we need for 2030," Mr Rudd said.

"That's the challenge that lies ahead of us - a difficult challenge, but one which is necessary to provide fundamentally for the long-term security of this nation."

His comments were a clear reference to the remediation funding needed to fill gaps.

In other examples of budget holes, the white paper will question the $2.2 billion acquisition of four C-17 Globemaster heav

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BLUIE006       5/1/2009 10:21:46 PM

The 7000 ton BMD - ANZAC replacements, Sound good! however one wonders if SLOC can be protected with only 11 planned major surface combantats?

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AMTP10F       5/2/2009 2:58:11 AM

The 7000 ton BMD - ANZAC replacements, Sound good! however one wonders if SLOC can be protected with only 11 planned major surface combantats?

In short, no.
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gf0012-aust       5/2/2009 3:31:20 AM
unfort the bits hilighted in yellow are true.

they're a stellar example of  what happens with respect to impulse buying.

all 4 projects have been used as examples when I've been involved in oprioject mgt training.

you can add the Shornets into the mix as well. 
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Volkodav       5/2/2009 8:00:56 AM

The 7000 ton BMD - ANZAC replacements, Sound good! however one wonders if SLOC can be protected with only 11 planned major surface combantats?

In short, no.
A couple questions on this ... our current fleet is (will be) 4 upgraded FFG07 and 8 ANZAC total 12 hulls, our planned fleet was 3 to 4 AWD and 8 upgraded ANZAC total 11 or 12 hulls; the white paper is maintaining numbers at 11 hulls .... was there some other plan to increase the number of hulls, i.e. treating the AWD's as replacements for the DDG's and replacing the FFG's with another buy later on?
Recent reports have suggested that there will be up to 20 offshore combatants, how capable will these ships be and will they be suitable for deployment outside our region, i.e. the Persian Gulf  or the Gulf of Aden (anti piracy missions)
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gf0012-aust       5/2/2009 4:54:37 PM
Recent reports have suggested that there will be up to 20 offshore combatants, how capable will these ships be and will they be suitable for deployment outside our region, i.e. the Persian Gulf  or the Gulf of Aden (anti piracy missions)

my understanding is that they're basically greenwater

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