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Subject: theage: 'Russia warns of military response to US missile shield'
fall out    7/8/2008 11:47:09 PM
Russia's Foreign Ministry says Moscow will be forced to make a military response if a US-Czech missile defence agreement is ratified. The statement comes hours after US and Czech officials reached an initial agreement on deploying elements of a missile defence system in the Eastern European country. Russia says the system would severely undermine European security balances by weakening Russia's missile capacity. The Foreign Ministry said today "we will be forced to react not with diplomatic, but with military-technical methods" if the agreement is ratified. It did not give specifics of what that response would entail. AP ----- What are people's thoughts here? Should the United States go ahead regardless of the interests of a major nuclear power and potentially destablise (further) the world. What are some of the options the Russians might go with ala military response? Could this push China and Russia closer? What are the chances of this issue being elevated to a critical issue surrounding the deteriorating relations between the West and particularly America and Russia? Also, even though Medvedev is officially in charge, Putin is still hanging around and may run to be president later too. FO
 
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fall out       7/10/2008 1:40:56 AM

FO, you may be a lefty but I'd hate to see you come to any harm. A friendly word of warning - never go to Poland or the Czech Republic and tell the locals they are Russia's traditional allies. I would genuinely fear for your safety. Russia has no traditional allies, save perhaps for Serbia, only oppressed and very reluctant neighbours.


 

Cheers.


haha, cheers mate.  I stand by what I said, I said they were Russia's traditional allies, not so much the other way around. ;)

 
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Gecko       7/10/2008 2:52:26 AM

I tend to think that the whole Eastern European missile shield thing has nothing to do with the Middle East. Why on earth would Iran want to fire a missile at the Czech Republic when it has Israel as a target?


I personally think that it is a confidence building measure on the part of the US, which want's to show its new allies in Eastern Europe that it will back them against a resurgent and aggressive Russia. It also sends the message to the Russians not to be aggressive towards these countries lightly. Personally I think it is a good way of doing it as the shield is purely defensive in nature, so demonstrates a willingness to defend without sending the aggressive messages that a large scale conventional deployment or basing of nuclear weapons would.

I think you will find the official line is its also meant to stop missles from the middle east aimed at the US ;) Czech  and Poland are good places because the shortest path flight profile from the middle east to the US is close to those areas. It definately protects Europe though which is why you haven't heard much from too many European MP's.
 
I think the US has a few motives here, one is to send a  message to Putin and other countries like China. The other is long term strategy on a defence sheild becasue there is not way its going to get built in Czech at the moment. It will take years to get approval from both politcal sides to pass through parliment or will require another election. Its largely unpopular with the Czech people and think Putin's comments are just hot air to keep it that way. Secondly, Iran doesn't have missles with the legs to reach the US (and won't likely for many years) so it can't be for any real imediate threat, its either long term strategic defence or for political means and at the moment I think its probably more focused toward the later.

 
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gf0012-aust       7/10/2008 4:35:37 AM


haha, cheers mate.  I stand by what I said, I said they were Russia's traditional allies, not so much the other way around. ;)



sorry, you're wrong - esp with the poles.  they haven't been friendly for hundreds of years - the horse tribes have familial ties, but as for the rest?  nope.
 
btw, my daughter is part polish, so I've been belted by the other side of the family about their view on the russians for a number of years.  in a pinch, they regard them as uncouth peasants with an overinflated self of importance about their place in history. (then again, they regard themselves as the saviours of europe against the mongols)
 

 
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AdvanceAustralia       7/10/2008 5:07:20 AM





haha, cheers mate.  I stand by what I said, I said they were Russia's traditional allies, not so much the other way around. ;)








sorry, you're wrong - esp with the poles.  they haven't been friendly for hundreds of years - the horse tribes have familial ties, but as for the rest?  nope.

 

btw, my daughter is part polish, so I've been belted by the other side of the family about their view on the russians for a number of years.  in a pinch, they regard them as uncouth peasants with an overinflated self of importance about their place in history. (then again, they regard themselves as the saviours of europe against the mongols)


 




I think FO was saying, very tongue in cheek, they were Russia's "friends". ie because Russia called them "friends" whether they liked it or not, even though they didn't consider the Russians friendly.

 
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doggtag       7/10/2008 10:34:37 AM

The US, in concert with its friends in Eastern Europe, should push ahead with plans for European missile defence. The optimistically-named "shield" is only designed to protect Europe from "rogue" states such as Iran. The planned deployment of anti-ballistic missiles will not be in sufficient quantity to defeat a full-scale attack by the  Soviets Russians and are not intended to do so.
Map of Europe:
http://www.sealairyachts.com/images/maps/europe_95b.jpg" width="700" border="0" />
 
Wouldn't missiles in Turkey, Greece, or even Bulgaria (or southern Germany, Austria, or Italy, even)
be better to defend Europe from Iranian missiles, rather than basing them in the Czech Republic?
(better to clip their wings as much as possible in the boost phase.)
 
I don't get it!
 
(besides, I seriously doubt if any of those other former Soviet countries that now comprise eastern Europe are all going to feel comfortable with Iranian possibly-WMD-tipped ballistic missiles arcing thru their airspace...if even one missile were to malfunction and land short, that's pretty much an instant declaration of war from just about anybody along the predicted flight paths!)
 
Seems to me that, if the US is "offering" (any one speculate on any bribery going on behind closed doors?) the shield at the request of the Czech government, what say does Russia even have in it?
 
...or are the Russians finally finding an opportunity to get back at us for chasing them out of Cuba?
 
Still, it looks like an ABM base(s) in the Czech Republic is the best place to prevent Russian missile attack: you're pretty much right there in the middle of most of Europe that would need protection...but someone remind, other than deliberate provocation from the west, why would the Russians be the ones making deliberate first strike ballistic attacks on western Europe?
The majority of any radiation fallout would be carried into Russia, more than the middle east.
(or is that Russia's beef with it? They don't want fallout landing in their laps? Why not then they declare hostilities at Iran, or whoever else launched?)
 
Someone ain't feedin' us the full story.
 
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Volkodav       7/11/2008 6:52:07 AM





haha, cheers mate.  I stand by what I said, I said they were Russia's traditional allies, not so much the other way around. ;)








sorry, you're wrong - esp with the poles.  they haven't been friendly for hundreds of years - the horse tribes have familial ties, but as for the rest?  nope.

 

btw, my daughter is part polish, so I've been belted by the other side of the family about their view on the russians for a number of years.  in a pinch, they regard them as uncouth peasants with an overinflated self of importance about their place in history. (then again, they regard themselves as the saviours of europe against the mongols)


 




Husaria anyone?

 
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Aussiegunneragain    Geko   7/13/2008 7:19:06 AM
I think you will find the official line is its also meant to stop missles from the middle east aimed at the US ;)
 
I know the official line, I just don't believe it ;-).
 
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gf0012-aust       7/13/2008 8:35:46 AM


Husaria anyone?



Not wanting to discount the capability of the Husaria as they have a clear history of competency, but wrt to stopping steppe invaders?
 
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Volkodav       7/13/2008 8:58:57 AM
Brain fade on my part.
 
I was thinking of the Ottomans in Vienna. 
 
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fall out       7/15/2008 10:58:48 AM
Now this has gotten off topic slightly; Husarian's and the Ottoman Empire.
 
Interesting to see that America said Russia could inspect the NMD sites in Poland and the Czech Republic but both of those countries have stated they don't want the Russians inspecting anything...definately some bitterness (hence the US being involved).
 
 

 
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