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Subject: Our Super Hornets. How many will we get?
hairy man    4/30/2008 5:50:06 AM
From article in The Australian.. 30/4/08. "It's likely the Orme review will confirm that the best outcome for Australia's future air requirements is a mixture of JSF and Super Hornets. How many and what mix will be the crux of the debate" I believe that the order for 24 FA18E/F consists of 18 2 seaters, 6 single seaters.(Not sure which is E or F.) I would say we will end up with a squadron of each, plus a small amount of Growlers, 4 - 6. Anyone with any better ideas?
 
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gf0012-aust       8/19/2008 5:32:34 AM

Bad news guys, the Growler, if ordered, will replace F/A-18F airframes one for one.  That is to say if we order 6 Growlers the order for F's will be reduced from 24 to 18.

that would make sense against the pig replacement though.  in fact its better as it means that the e-management options go up due to greater redundancy.  ie more available frames to place on station whilst one's in the shed getting worked on.

Another hope was that some consideration would be given to buying or leasing a squadrons worth of E's instead of blowing more money on HUG.
Jury is still out on that.  Whitepaper recommendations and "hull cull" decisions have not been made public
 
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Volkodav       8/19/2008 6:14:14 AM
Jury is still out on that.  Whitepaper recommendations and "hull cull" decisions have not been made public
 
So there is still a chance that we will finally have a future proofed fighter force with an upgraded type to be supplemented by a current generation type and then replaced with a state of the art new type.  We just need to hope the F-35 buy is reduced in favour of acquiring a new of evolved type to replace the SH's at a later date, that way allowing the RAAF to maintain two types into the future.
 
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gf0012-aust       8/19/2008 6:35:44 AM


So there is still a chance that we will finally have a future proofed fighter force with an upgraded type to be supplemented by a current generation type and then replaced with a state of the art new type.  We just need to hope the F-35 buy is reduced in favour of acquiring a new of evolved type to replace the SH's at a later date, that way allowing the RAAF to maintain two types into the future.


I wouldn't over analyse my comment.  It's merely to reinfoorce that a significant amount of platform decisions have not been made public (and in most cases its because the numbers are still being crunched)
 
I've always favoured a two platform fleet for a number of reasons, and as an extension of that would have preferred the financial devils advocate advantage of getting Typhoon in the interim over Shornet.
 
However, there are a number of logical reasons as to why we would staying with an all US multi platform  solution, and pragmatism has to triumph...
 
just not rafale or gripen.. :) eg, have a look at the Rafales sawtooth LO panel finish and its worse than the fit and finish on a Mig 29.  (so I have some serious doubts as to claims about inherent visibility and sig management capability (and that includes all the hysterical fanfare about Spectre).  Not to keen on Gripen due to swedish workmanship issues witnessed elsewhere etc....
 
 
in the end, the possibility of getting growler makes getting the shornet less of a choking point for me.....
 
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Aussiegunneragain    Volkodav   8/19/2008 7:03:43 AM

Bad news guys, the Growler, if ordered, will replace F/A-18F airframes one for one.  That is to say if we order 6 Growlers the order for F's will be reduced from 24 to 18.
 
We don't have the tanker fleet to support the extras in the strike/recon role anyway and the G's can operate in the strike role while conducting EW operations.
 
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Volkodav       8/19/2008 7:22:27 AM
Not to keen on Gripen due to swedish workmanship issues witnessed elsewhere etc....
 
I get where you are coming from there, however I have heard and read some very good things about the Gripen.  The NG would be a very capable aircraft to have in greater numbers to support of a smaller quantity of top tier strike fighters, if we actually had the pilots to fly them.
 
Wind back the clock to the late 80's early 90's add an F/A-18D purchase to replace the F-111's instead of performing AUP, sell some our F/A-18A's to Canada (say 30) and build 50 or more Gripens to replace not only the sold on Hornets but also the RAN's Skyhawks. 
 
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gf0012-aust       8/19/2008 7:33:40 AM
if we actually had the pilots to fly them.

RAAF already has a profile thats more like a Commonwealth/NATO Squadron than one made up of locals... we couldn't get much lower before it becomes "spot the skip"
 
 
 
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gf0012-aust       8/19/2008 7:37:16 AM
Not that keen on quoting Aviation Week as they've come out with some pearlers in the past but:
 
 
note:
 
It's part of Boeing's counterattack on Lockheed Martin's claim that the decreasing price of the F-22, which is now at $140 million each, will make it so attractive that Australia may reconsider its buy -- already being paid for -- of 24 two-seat F/A-18F Super Hornets. Until Australia's recent change in government, a number of U.S. officials said the government was considering a second lot of 24 Super Hornets and a six-plane squadron of EA-18G Growlers.

 
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Volkodav       8/19/2008 7:39:29 AM
RAAF already has a profile thats more like a Commonwealth/NATO Squadron than one made up of locals... we couldn't get much lower before it becomes "spot the skip"
 
They are still doing better than submarines.
 
With the hassels the RAAF are having with recruiting applying for Air Combat Officer is starting to look interesting.
 
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