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Subject: USA's Friends
Mike    5/5/2002 1:20:50 AM
Who are USA's friends right now? I mean Friends, not just temporary allies. Russia? Israel? China? EU? UK? Leprechauns? I mean do we actually have friends? We don't even pay UN dues! Does anybody actually love us? Who?
 
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RF    To NewGuy   11/13/2002 7:03:31 PM
Would USSR beat the Nazis w/o USA? Yes, it would've taken longer and been costlier, but USSR could have done it. LL to USSR was 11 Billion, still 1/3 of what was sent to UK! Now, answer my question: Could the Allies won the war w/o USSR? What if Hitler did not invade USSR? Would UK continue fighting? Would USA even enter the war and plan any invasion of the Fortress Europe? "I also contest your claim that the "worst" camps were only in East Germany, show us all some solid proof of that statement, or we will simply ignore it as a falsehood." Learn the difference between East Germany and Poland. Here's my evidence: Auschwitz, Treblinka, Majdanek were all in Poland.
 
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RF    Causes of US entrance in war   11/13/2002 7:09:54 PM
don't think about Pearl Harbor, morons, that's was the trigger. "But for me it doesn´t matter how many camps each side liberated, they had common goal and enemy and they did what they could. By way or another." No, USSR and USA did not have a "common goal" in mind in that war, putting imperialism aside. Neither USSR nor, especially, USA entered the war to save Jews or others...The Soviets experienced Nazi programs on their skin (Nazis went after Slavs too), but the USA itself had the heritage of Anti-Semitism, not to mention that eugenics was pretty much started in US and then Exported to Germany. (Nazis admired US segregation practices too). "I see the USA´s participation in WWII (in Europe)as a mixture of many things.. they had to stop Nazis before they become too powerful (realpolitik), they had to help their allies/friends like GB and I also believe that many took it as a fight for democracy against tyranny..." These are all coincidental, America has not stood for Democracy or Self-Determination, it's just propaganda. There was nothing in USA that was inherently opposed to Fascism, NOTHING! Economics is by the most important reason US got into the war.
 
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RF    UN owes US?   11/13/2002 7:13:03 PM
Where'd ya read that, bro? theonion.org? "The United Nations OWES the United States money, not the other way around." Show me the proof! Maybe u mean more in a moral (ur own junkymoral) sense?
 
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RF    The camps Yankee did liberate   11/13/2002 7:15:50 PM
were in West Germany, for example Belsen, these were originally not death camps, but as the war went bad, the Germans stopped feeding the prisoners at all... Still, these camps should not be confused with the ones in Poland.
 
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NewGuy    RE:To NewGuy   11/14/2002 12:00:21 AM
Oh, hes finally back, took you you long enough. You can argue all you want, but the facts speak for themselves: 1) The Russians got a total of 21.9 billion US dollars (and that is 1940s dollars, NOT 2002 dollars) worth of aid in WWII. Not a penny of which they choose to or were asked to repay. If you attempt to say that over 20 billion dollars of aid was not *extremely* helpfull to Russia, then you are fibbing. 2) The US produced well over 40 % of the armaments in the entire world from 1943 to 1945, counting military vehicles (tanks, trucks, etc), aircraft, ships, and bombs and munitions. 3) We gave more military equipment and supplies to the allies than the Germans and Japanese together produced during the entire war! That had to make a major impact. The US made the invasion of France possible, supplied over 80% of the troops and material on the Western front during the fight to and in Germany, virtually single-handledy defeated the Japanese in the Pacific, and did all this *while it was by far the largest supplier to all the allied nations*. No other nation on Earth could have done that. Not Britian, not France, and not the USSR. So there. NewGuy
 
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NewGuy    RE:Causes of US entrance in war   11/14/2002 12:08:08 AM
"The Soviets experienced Nazi programs on their skin (Nazis went after Slavs too), but the USA itself had the heritage of Anti-Semitism, not to mention that eugenics was pretty much started in US and then Exported to Germany. (Nazis admired US segregation practices too)." Gee RF, I thought the Nazis might have learned a litle from Comrade Stalin -- after all he did murder 11 + million Russians according to the Soviet's own records. NewGuy
 
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giblets    RE:To NewGuy   11/27/2002 4:22:49 AM
Hi there are a lot of fact being thrown around here, not all terribly accurate, you only have to look about to see the make up of division and regiments etc that took part in the D-day (57,000 US to 75,000 Britsh and otehr troops)landings to see that America no way made up 80% of the Western Front (unless you have been watching saving private Ryan)(in fact it was not until September 1944 that American numbers were greaterthan British and Canadian numbers. AS for American Entry to WW2, American may not necesarily have ever declared war on Germany (Germany, to her cost declared War on the USA). Russia, yes did recieve an awful lot of stuff from the USA, though you are clearly unaware of the true feeling of the Russians to the Germans (they would have won at ANY cost,with US help or not, just a lot more lives), the Americans only entered the war very late 41', and their troops did not see action until Novemebr 42 in Africa. And bomber numbers in the UK were not enough to really make an impact til 43'. The tide turned at Stalingrad, in 42. By which time the German war machine was starting to slow. Though I will admit that we have the Americans to thank for a Democratic (ableit lefty) western Europe, instead of Communist.
 
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CanadianBaron    RE:To NewGuy   11/28/2002 7:42:46 PM
This is a classic WW2 debate, and I believe 99% of the time it is argued poorly. It seems everyone tries to be either "Uncle Sam won it all, go USA blah blah blah" or "The allies were going to win anyways, Russians did most of the work USA sucks blah blah blah" Without the Americans, the Russians and British wouldn't have won. Probably. If they managed to pull it off alone it would've cost so many more lives and so much more money that Europe would still be impovershed today. Without England and the Americans keeping hitler busy on two fronts the russians would've folded. They were all essential, but nobody did (or could have done) it all single-handedly. And remember, the Canadians had a beach in Normandy all to ourselves. *grin*
 
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sooner    RE:USA's Friends   1/28/2004 10:19:48 AM
My friend, good point. I don't believe anyone truly loves us. We are the "team to beat" so to speak. You all know how that goes.
 
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Okoshka    RE:USA's Friends   2/6/2004 2:57:04 AM
Friend is that who like you without interest. Americans behaviour don't make easy to be their honest friend. They think they are better in everything than any other. They know everything better than any other. On the olympics they didn't mix with other nations. All olympic teams lived in the olympic willage exept the US team. All countries soldiers can be judged by the International Court except US soldiers. A few days ago come home a group of doctors from Iran. They helped after the earthquake. They were asked how could work together so many different nationality. They said there was no problem. When help was needed the Arab and the Israeli could work together well. Only one nation caused some problems because they were more clever then the others and know everything better than the others. We are good to the US to be NATO members to give our name to US actions. We are good to help the US in the war against terrorism in Afghanistan and in Iraq. But when we want to travel to the US we are treated like potential arab terrorists. Once I were talking with someone who taught american and russian students too. She told that th americans and the russians are the some silly stuff the difference is that the ruussians had to learn something abot the world the americans have the right to not know anything. To my greatest surprise about three years later a man who had american and russian bussines partners too started his opinion with exactly the same words: Americans and russians are the same silly stuff, the difference is that the russians are good natured. Americans think about you as primitive second class persons. And you can see it on their behaviour. GB as the friend of US? In the last 20 years GB got money from those EU funds which are to help the less developed EU members. Whithout US political support GB would be a marginal country in Europe at the edge of the map. The unconditional friendship.
 
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