Well Chirac keeps given Bush advise on how he should run his country, so ...

When Turkey joins Europe France (and Germany) will lose influence in Europe, because Turkey is able to stand up to France and Turkey is too big to ignore when it does.

I think main problem is Turkey having close relations with USA. France have enough already from one of US allies (UK) in the EU, they probably do not want another one.

I think you are correct ilpars... in fact I believe that every statement Bush makes in favour of Turkey joining the EU makes the process less likely to occure, as Turkey will be associated with the U.S. which is currently not terribly popular in Europe...

I wish Chirac would get over the fact that the French lost at Waterloo. You're no longer masters of Europe, pal.

Heh, heh. France might be suspicious from Bush's over-support of Turkey. They may think that "Hmm. Maybe Bush do not want to see Turkey in EU. That could be why he supports enthusiasticly. " . Politics are a weird game.

I feel myself like an extra in a political soup opera. Bush rebuff to Chirac over Turkey Tuesday, June 29, 2004 Posted: 1724 GMT (0124 HKT) Bush: As a European power, Turkey belongs in the EU. ISTANBUL, Turkey (CNN) -- U.S. President George W. Bush has repeated a call for the European Union to admit Turkey, despite criticism by France's President Jacques Chirac that he was meddling in EU affairs. Bush said Tuesday that Turkey belongs in the EU and that Europe is "not the exclusive club of a single religion" in what amounted to a rebuff to the French leader. In an address at Istanbul university, Bush refused to back down in the face of Chirac's criticism that Bush had no business urging the EU to set a date for Turkey to start entry talks into the union. He said that Turkey was moving rapidly to meet the criteria for EU membership. "America believes that as a European power, Turkey belongs in the European Union," Bush said. Turkey was a bridge to the wider world, Bush said. "Your success is vital to the future of progress and peace in Europe and in the broader Middle East," he said. He said that Turkish EU membership would be a "crucial advance" in relations between the Muslim world and the West because Turkey was part of both. The main message in the U.S. President's speech was a bid to mend relations between Muslims and Americans that were left tattered by the Iraq war. "We must strengthen the ties and trust and good will between ourselves and the peoples of the Middle East," he said. Bush held up Turkey as an example of a Muslim democracy. "Including Turkey in the EU would prove that Europe is not the exclusive club of a single religion, and it would expose the 'clash of civilizations' as a passing myth of history," Bush said. Chirac took Bush to task Monday over his call for Turkey's admission to the European Union. "If President Bush really said that in the way that I read, then not only did he go too far, but he went into territory that isn't his," Chirac said of a remark Bush made over the weekend. "It is is not his purpose and his goal to give any advice to the EU, and in this area it was a bit as if I were to tell Americans how they should handle their relationship with Mexico." Turkey has been keen to use this week's two-day NATO summit in Istanbul to showcase its credentials as a westward-looking democracy before December, when EU leaders decide if it has met the political criteria to be put on the formal road to EU membership. Countries such as Germany, Italy and Britain strongly back Ankara's bid, but Chirac's government has expressed wariness about kicking off a formal process to admit the relatively poor country of 70 million people. Bush's verbal spat with Chirac threatened again to upset relations with France, which leaders on both sides of the Atlantic had been working to mend. Chirac was one of the most outspoken critics of the U.S.-led war in Iraq, but France recently approved a U.S.-backed U.N. resolution recognizing the new Iraqi authority.

Let's look at the different EU nations position on Turkey: Germany: There is in principle nothing to hinder Turkey joining, but Germany knows who is going to pay. At the moment there is a large integration with Poland and others as new members - it is costly in the short term, and it does strain the administrative resources to educate civil servants, that hardly know what a limited liability company is. France has not rationalised its agricultural sector to the extend other European nations has. This means that the french farmer is on the dole. And support for Turkey will have to come out of the money to the French farmers. Britain is more or less indifferent, as Britain does not have the problem the other major EU countries have: Lack of oil. The staunch supporters of the USA policy in Iraq all have enough oil: Britain, Norway and Denmark. There is another and transnational split in Europe: Politically Europe is divided almost equally between socialdemocrats (liberal in american parlance) and Liberal/Conservative. The socialdemocrats are opposed at the moment to any extension of the EU with Turkey. Partly because Erdogan is NOT a social democrat, partly because the social democrats are in big trouble, due to the fact, that the labour movement has gained so exellent conditions for their members, that Europe loses jobs in industrial sector, thus reducing the social democratic power base and economic competitiveness: This is Schröders problem. Turkey: There are some real issues here: The backward agriculture in eastern Turkey. The civil war against the PKK was in its basis a peasant revolt - and NOT ethnical. Turgut Özal made the mistake of adressing the real issue - the economic problems in eastern Turkey before the revolt had been crushed - Özal thought you could do business with the thugs that had put themselves in charge of the grieviencies: Just as Chamberlain thought he could work with Hitler - there is absolutely no difference. Turkey can, and will eventually be, a valuable addition to the EU, if: 1. Turkish role in the oil-supply of Europe is secured (we need some tough people to do business with arabs and russians in the south) 2. Turkish agriculture and industry start growing crops that supplement the EU farmers crops: Cotton, oranges, tea, tobacco - IN A QUALITY and at a PRICE that satisfies european consumers - the most pampered in the world. The quality problems in Turkish Industry could be solved by having a bunch of German plantmanagers. The main problem is that (as far as I know) these interesting crops (with their associated industry) don't grow in the eastern Turkish problem area. The human rights issues will be solved as the new generation of police-officers reach senior positions.

"2. Turkish agriculture and industry start growing crops that supplement the EU farmers crops: Cotton, oranges, tea, tobacco - IN A QUALITY and at a PRICE that satisfies european consumers - the most pampered in the world." Interesting part is Turkey is growing all of these crops in quantity and in reasonable price. By the way Turkish Tobacco is one of world's finest. James Bond always smokes Turkish tobacco in novels and in the films that Sean Connery played the Bond. Camel's became famous because it uses Turkish tobacco. (and that is why it uses the name Camel). Maybe French do not want us in because of our rapidly growing wine. As I have heard, it has a very unique taste and much cheaper than French.

Up to you to make the whole problem of Turkey adhesion to EU a French problem, but it isn't. It is an EU problem. As often the French spoke more loudly than the others. And it can't be denied that Bush's statements on Turkey will do no good to Turkey's candidature. PS: true Ilpars, you have some good wines? Mmmmh, I'm thinking more positively of Turkey becoming EU member...