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Subject: Israel
tamak    1/4/2008 2:36:27 PM
Is now,using an honorable discharge system like us!They want to boost moral etc.I hope it works,and if I wasn't too old I would, volunteer my Jewishness, to the IDF also!
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aceofw       1/4/2008 5:07:48 PM
Not really. This system is a really bad idea in my opinion.
One reason is that it distinguishes between combat (gold), support (silver), and non-combat (bronze) soldiers, it further seperates officers and a bunch of others who suppoesedly did an especially meaningful service, and thus recieve a star on their card.

Now, beyond the fact this reminds me of some kinder-garden gadget, this means an intelligence annalyst doing an important and hard work, will now get the same card as a sprinkler operator...
Just last week I had a similiar discussion with a mother who's son fell in Lebannon about why EVERYONE gets the war symbol, and not just the fighters - There has to be unity in the ranks. The army is made up of many and diverse positions for a reason, and it's impossible to generalize that one job is more important than another.

Every soldier needs to have some pride in his work, he needs to feel a part of the entire army, or he will do a crappy work and people down the chain will suffer.
It would be much better if it would simply state if a soldier served his time, or failed to enlist at all.

Another thing is that the system is supposed to provide with benefits to soldiers in reserve, however currently these "benefits" are discount in enetring state parks rather then discounts on buying a house, which only serves to add insult to injury.

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Shirrush    Losers!   1/4/2008 6:55:40 PM
It is rumored that Rabin started the peace process, which ultimately led to Oslo and to disaster, out of his intimate knowledge of the IDF's incompetence and stupidity. You don't go to war such such retards, you find another way.

This card  business is just a new example of what we knew all along, but like Rabin still prefer to look the other way since most of us are convinced that when the excrement gets into the blower, the smarter civvies from the Reserves will be there to save the day again.

Now, not only are they attempting to create a card-bearing military caste system in place of the informal, existing one, they are also making sure that our best-and brightest will keep on avoiding the vital non-combat branches such as logistics and most of the intel postings. Thus, these branches will forever be staffed with unmotivated underachievers, and when war comes again, as it usually does, our fighters will again not get the proper quantity and quality of support they need to win. The Winograd report, when it comes out, is likely to have a thick chapter on the mediocrity and the neglect of supplies and maintenance in the Summer 2006 Lebanon war, when reserve units heeded the call-up only to find their wartime equipment warehouses empty, or filled with non-usable and sometimes incongruous items. There are some reports of reserve paratroopers finding  British
WWII-styled webbings with pouches for FAL mags, and US steel helmets in their "kitbags"! (The FAL rifles were entirely phased out by the early '80s of last century).

I'm not even mentioning the  lack of
eco-strategic vision of a nation which encourages the best and most fit of its youths to go and get killed in battle, and does everything it can in order to cram all the rest into a discontented underclass in the military service, which was previously understood at the only place in which all get an even chance to get yelled at, run to exhaustion, sleep-deprived, underfed and put in harm's way regardless of their education, socio-economic status, or skin tone.

If there was equal incentive for all the jobs that need to be done in order to defend the country, then maybe, just maybe, there wouldn't be surprises anymore on mobilization day, the troops would have adequate clothing and accommodation, the Navy would be updated about new threats in its sector, and so on...

Now, this will not happen, because if one can make the gold card and the honors, why should he go for bronze and humiliation?

In addition to its stupidity, there's also much hypocrisy in that plastic card deal: while it is right to reward combatants who risk their lives every day to protect the nation, pieces of plastic are a lot cheaper than extra pay or R&R vouchers.
Maybe I'm thick, but I also do not see any logical relationship between the honorable discharge cards and their stated purpose, which is to encourage young people to do their duty and to deter draft dodging.

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Shirrush    Hey ace!   1/4/2008 6:56:53 PM
How are you doing? How's that PaZa"M of yours ticking?
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aceofw       1/5/2008 11:04:16 AM
I'm doing fine, and after all, "The Pazam is f***ing"...
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Shirrush    Aceofw   1/5/2008 4:21:24 PM
C'mon man! Gimme the story! are you a TC/officer yet? I had a theory that your disappearance from these boards for a while was caused by you being exceedingly busy...
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aceofw       1/5/2008 6:17:14 PM
no, I'm sorry to say I got kicked out of my TC course,  part for being stuipid, part for being stuipid early, and part  because the "gananim" (TC course instructors) are a fartheaded bunch. Since then I've returned to my battalion to become squad/crew member for the battalion's "samgad" (the second-in-command). Nothing much since then, the usual work in the west bank, and since last month an exercise period up north.

It was actually a very nice exercise, incluing crossing the "yahudia" stream by tank at sunrise, which was a beautiful drive.

That's pretty much it, I'm still around from time to time, if I've got something to contribute
I post. At any case, I see you guys are holding the fort as well as always.

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battar    Jobs for the boys   1/6/2008 4:03:45 PM
Hey - I object !
Not everyone who goes for the non-combat positions far from the battle field and close to the train/bus station and burger/Shawarma is unmotivated. On the contrary, some of them see the IDF as an opportunity for gaining job experience - very valuable on the labour market. Funny thing though, all those boys who want the technical jobs and then take their experience to the defence/hi-tech industry all speak Russian.
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