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Subject: Americans must respect Islam
salaam al-aqaaid    5/13/2004 10:18:35 AM
The outrageous atrocities commited by Americans at the Abu al-Grayyib prison complex speaks to a need for the United States Americans to give sensetivity training to its entire military so that they will no longer offind Muslims with the contemptious use of women as prison guards and unsavery adiction to homosexual pornographies. These things are offinsive to the Muslims community. Have you no shame? You must remove all women and homosexuals from contact with Muslim prisoners. This is offinsive.
 
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elcid    are also not alternatives to having a particular civic identity    8/26/2004 8:26:59 AM
Au contraire mon ami. The really devout people I know of all the great religions (Christian, Juadism, Islam, and I would add Hindu), mostly reject secular nationalism (I know a few Jewish exceptions to that statement). They think in terms of morality, and other things, having far greater priority than mere national advantage. Which was my original point.
 
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elcid    RE:Both Judism and Islam are explicitly nationalistic    8/26/2004 8:27:40 AM
Nice exposition of your position, Celebrium.
 
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elcid    What rescued Islamic fundamentalism from the cul-de-sac of history was oil revenues,   8/26/2004 8:30:25 AM
It is certainly true that Saudi money in particular, and some other Gulf money, was invested. Not just in the war in Afghanistan, but in building Wahabbi mosques, in the USA among other places.
 
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elcid    RE:A book review (Good Moslim, Bad Moslem)   8/26/2004 8:34:29 AM
Nice exposition Scholar. However, I do detect a movement in Islam in places like Europe, the USA and Canada to become very "spiritual" rather than "physical world" oriented. That is, some of the senior leaders are saying (and saying with some eloquence) that what matters is the "spiritual" battle of doing good, when one has the option not to.
 
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elcid    And you're gonna repeat that to your children, OF COURSE   8/26/2004 8:42:17 AM
Not me. My child grew up in an ultra-Orthodox Jewish day care center, the only one in Alaska. And all of her life I was active in Baptist and Roman Catholic churches, and sang in the majority of churches available. While there were only 3 Sikh families in Alaska, we associated with one of them (staying at their home) until they moved to Israel. From 2000-2003 we also associated with Sikhs in Washington state. When the Rebbi asked my wife if I would be upset my child asks to go to the bathroom in Yiddish, and sang childrens songs in Hebrew, she replied "Oh no, not Sidney! He thinks it is wonderful." Which I did, and do. I never told her what to believe, and I have all the great literature of religion, including the Holy Koran, in my house. Since we don't watch television, she is a reader - and a linguist.
 
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doggtag    The Celtic deitic heirarchy, one view   8/26/2004 8:42:29 AM
A basic rundown of early (pre-catholic England) deitic structure can be found at: http://www.wicca.com/celtic/wicca/celtic.htm (and for the record, Wicca is NOT devil worshipping: it is more Nature oriented. Far as I'm concerned, all that is Nature was also created by the Divine, so therefore to "worship" Nature is still indeed to revel in the Creator's creation. Besides, building a more balanced rapport with the extensions of the Divine's creation certainly increases your living in harmony and balance with the cosmos. Just don't be foolish and surrender your beliefs to the ignorance of men and women who seek to control and manipulate all to their own selfish favor. Of course, it gets even more confusing when you start looking at early Scandinavian deitic structures... (And I only worship cows when they're basting on the grill with a fine marinade. Consider that my animal sacrifice.).
 
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elcid    REally really really I don't get it   8/26/2004 8:46:33 AM
Religion has to change because social problems change. Just as politics must evolve. Mohammad was a bit of a feminist - for his age. He is the very first to give a woman the right to a divorse - in any religion or culture. He tied the right to marry to the ability to support a wife, and even if you were a billionaire he limited the number of wives. [Jesus didn't do that, and tells a story about a dozen wise and foolish bridesmaids in a single event]. Social problems need to be addressed, as they come up, and as they are recognized. It may be that God, in some theoretical sense, always knew better, but humans are still learning. About themselves anyway.
 
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elcid    do you have any evidence WHATSOEVER    8/26/2004 8:48:59 AM
Sure we have. Look up the word. You may not be impressed with the evidence - altough it is better than for any other ancient person - but there is a remarkable amount of it. But why are you fixaged on Jesus miracles? Are they the most important thing about him, in your view? Ghandi was much more impressed with his ideas. Why aren't you?
 
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elcid    Why do people pray in difficult times    8/26/2004 8:53:36 AM
It probably works for many on many occasions. Prayer is often a form of self hipnosis. And it may also involve somethin akin to telepathy. People do seem to be able to communicate - as a techie guy I think it is really radio waves - we know nerves are electrical and we know all things electrical generate radio waves. I have seen NRL material indicating the human brain can understand some kinds of signal modulations (at least with audio and vidio information). And once, before a battle, I thought, as you do, that a Catholic Priest was being silly in his involking of "protection" - but no one on our side was even scratched - in circumstances where no one should have survived. I am not so sure he was being silly...it surely didn't hurt!
 
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elcid    Where exactly does one draw the line between having faith and believing foolishness?.   8/26/2004 8:55:10 AM
St Paul has something to say about this. One is not to believe just anything, but "test" what one is told, he says. But are we not off topic?
 
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