Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Armed Forces of the World Discussion Board
   Return to Topic Page
Subject: How rank France in world power?
french stratege    4/23/2005 9:33:41 PM
o be a world power means to master a number of power tools and capacities: Economic power: France have fourth largest economy in world, even UK GNP seems on a par.But in fact France has a slightly bigger GDP in Puchasing Power Parity, a stronguer industry as its share in GNP is bigger, and especially in military usable industry (automotive, steel, microelectronic ...). Its trade balnce is positive unless US and UK.We benefit of Euro in sense that in a crisis, Euro would not go down like pound.Our financial market is less sensitive to crisis than UK. Then our saving, gold and currencies reserves are higher. France has 43 companies in the WORLD FORTUNE 500 ranking, one more than Germany and much more than UK or Italy.For example UK industry is stronguer than France in prescription drug but you can not use that for war. War potential: US: 100; Japan: 55, Germany ,40, France 25, UK 20. Diplomatic influence: should I said that French diplomatic network is world class and second to US only (with better skills).That our foreign aid is higher than UK or US in GNP %? That we have VETO right in UNO? That our cultural influence is world second after US? Thank to our industry we can substitute to US or Russia to deliver to a friend the whole set of weapons INDEPENDANTLY (from airfighters to subs via tank or C4ISR) and can shift power balance in any area.WE ARE THE SECOND WESTERN INDEPENDANT SUPPLIER AFTER US FOR CAPACITIES. We are the only Euro nation to have the full INDEPENDANT world reco network which is second to USA. RECO satellites, Telecom satellites (bandwith second to US), ELINT satellites, DSP satellites (in 2008), METEO satellites, spy ships, 30 ELINT ground station in word with 2 dedicated to spy US satelites, SPACE SURVEILLANCE RADAR. An unkown assets is that we are the only nation with US which can produce any currencies in world (to make false money in perfect imitation - we are the best in Europe for money technology) Sensitivity to energy imports: Our oil company is fourth in world and we have ROBUST assets in non middle east areas like Gabon, Angola etc...We produce our oil industry heavy equipment and our industry is world second of US in this field. Our nuclear energy production is world second in world and give us independance on electricity.Our influence in Africa secure minerals imports. Sensitivity to embargo: France has world class semiconductors facilities and hold the more advanced Europe wafer fab (joint venture between Motorola, SGS Thomson and Philips). Our auto maker build 7,5 million car /year, we have Airbus main designed office in France and so on...Our industry is pretty well balanced and produce almost everything at world class. Then we are the only Euro nation with a launch pad and Euro leader in Space.So we do not depend on US or other nation. We produce the second set of weapons after US and we do not depend of any supplier. Military technology: we are mastering everything form nukes to C4ISR with a technological level recognised by US as world second (while UK is close after).Of course neither Japan, Germany or China enjoy such an advantage. Nukes: our nuclear force are world THIRD and we produce precise counterforce weapons INDEPENDANTLY.Good second strike ability.400 warheads vs 200 for UK.(and we have stored weapons we can reactivate).3 SSBN can strike anywhere in the world. Military skills: our war academy is renown with US and UK.Israelis send some generals to perfectionate. Should I remember that Saudia Arabia asked French to crush rebellion in Mecka and not to US or UK?Saudis special forces and military stalled two weeks before asking France help.We did it in two days with 70 commandos leading Saudi commando (and using combat nerve gaz killing 2000 rebels). Mitary capacities. Second world force projection from 2007 to 2012 as a single Cdg with 3E2C and 40 Rafales, protected by 19 frigates with top ASW, 6 SSN and 3 Horizon with ASTER 30 outperform anything UK have: Indeed UK has 2 ACTIVE small carriers (with limited self protection and 60 harriers), they will not have any BVR fighters with FA2 retirement, and not antiship capacity since Harrier GR7/9 have NO RADAR!! UK air force has an handfull of non operational EF supported by 63 old Tornado ADV.No medium range airdefense for their troops. They have more SSN (soon reduced to 8 only) and military transport but we rely on civilian military prepared transports from french companies and our overseas bases to accumulate locally . ONLY US, UK, Russia and Japan has a sub force strong enough to put in danger our fleet. In fact we can crush any OPFOR airforce of 100 SU27/Mig29 (plus old MIGS or SU) without AWAC, ONLY relying on Cdg (even I agree a second would be better and needed). Most of nation do not have ENOUGH YAKHONT equivalent missiles to crush our naval force until our second carrier is operational. UK is unable to do that and in 2010 only 4 T45 will have entered service
 
Quote    Reply

Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest
french stratege    reft13   5/13/2005 2:24:41 PM
I said about a major support including space assets, and the most sphisticated weapons Egypt is deprived today (ECM, C4ISR, AIM120 etc). If US support actively Egypt our chance are weak. Today US refuse to sell some weapons and systems to avoid to alter balance with Israel.
 
Quote    Reply

gixxxerking    RE:reft13   5/13/2005 2:34:00 PM
Today you arent invading a US ally. But when you did in 1956 the UNITED STATES made you leave without firing a shot. And you were an actual ally back then. Not a pseudo enemy as you are today. Its funny that you say if the US supports Egypt. The US is supporting Egypt.
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege    Ret13/gxxx :upperlayer of systems    5/13/2005 2:40:16 PM
http://www.teamultimedia.com/downloads/handbook.pdf gxxx You will see that Egypt is not in any list of reliable allies (cf Chap34). Ret13: if France would ahve sell only some mistal of M2000 to Iraq it would have made big losses as US could have cope easily with by their numbers.But great quantity of sophisticated ammuntions, force multiplication tools and ECM matter more. Egypt do not have the upperlayer of systems which makes difference and special functions in its weapons.And it is why Israel build its own defense industry in Radar, ammunitions and ECM. A exported F16 radar looks good but it is less good when it lack the right ECCM software.
 
Quote    Reply

gixxxerking    RE:gxxx bad faith again?   5/13/2005 2:40:58 PM
"If you want to do an 'illegal" war (according to UNO rules) it is your problem. Nothing more." --FS So I am a criminal huh? Labels dont bother me. But the US doesnt need the apporval of the world to carry out it interest. France does. So your invasion proposal would be just that unless you can explain to GWB or his successor why the US should allow France to dominate Egypt. Assuming you get that approval, you then have to convince the Egyptian Military by force. And looking at what you can realistically bring into the AO in 3 months, its not a convincing arguement. And to address the laughable claim of the US vs French weapons in Iraq. First we had embargo on Iraq so none of your shiny toys would have even made it there. Second what ever you managed to sneak in under the Embargo would have been bombed as we often did prior to the war. The US would never willingly fight on equal terms as you are saying France would attempt to do with Egypt.
 
Quote    Reply

Asmodée    RE:show some respect for the French...ret13f, gf0012, JIMF   5/13/2005 2:41:22 PM
just to say that the A400m will be operationnal in 2009 (first delivery in 2007)...
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege    suez56: you paid it in 2003!   5/13/2005 2:45:20 PM
"But when you did in 1956 the UNITED STATES made you leave without firing a shot" First: It is UK which leave first then French because US played with UK pounds while Russian were using nuclear threat against UK and France. Second: as a consequence France decided to build its nuclear deterrent and be be not dependant on foreign weapons. A founding act! Without US 56 behaviour France would be more dependant on US (like UK), and so we could not have threaten to put our UNO veto against US.You paid in 2003 for 1956!
 
Quote    Reply

gixxxerking    A400m   5/13/2005 2:46:40 PM
Nice plane but a bit late for a 2009 war. Take a look: http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/fla/
 
Quote    Reply

gixxxerking    RE:suez56: you paid it in 2003!   5/13/2005 2:49:08 PM
No because without your blessing we made Saddam look like this: http://www.floogie.org/saddam-hussein-captured.jpg The difference is we didnt need "old Europe" blessing...lol.
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege    We don't need your blessing!   5/13/2005 2:55:28 PM
We don't need your blessing also: if US start to help Egypt we could scale up militarly and we would playing agaisnt US interest and organising alliance agaisnt US .Rival of US would access to French high tech from Iran to China via North Korea or Syria or even Cuba and Venezela.We would make your paid an higher priec if you would impeach us to give a lesson to Egypt.Or to give this lessons well after.France is more important than Egypt on world scale. And don't say you would attack france! Do you attack russia or China because they sell to Israel or North Korea?
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege    RE:We don't need your blessing!Hoop a typo error   5/13/2005 2:56:25 PM
"And don't say you would attack france! Do you attack russia or China because they sell to IRAN or North Korea?"
 
Quote    Reply



 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics