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Subject: Greatest Military Upset in History
Aeb4ever    1/28/2005 1:11:39 AM
What is the greatest military upset in history?
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ej    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History    2/3/2005 12:36:33 PM
Stalingard its beats all the rest hands down
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AlbanyRifles    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History    2/3/2005 1:12:30 PM
Stalingrad was no was just a meatgrinder where the force with greater will won out.
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Ehran    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History    2/3/2005 4:10:31 PM
dunno if i would call midway a real upset but man it certainly was lucky. pretty much every random event that could break for the americans did. i read someplace that the usn has been wargaming midway ever since it happened and have yet to have it come out as well as the real battle.
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Jodhpur    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History   2/3/2005 8:18:35 PM
Battle of Crécy, between the french and the english (heavily outnumbered),mid fourteenth century; the heavily-armored knight was no lomger sire of the battlefield. Dislodged from his perch by the greatest,unwashed of them all: massed infantry, Welsh to boot. Up the longbow & a sad adieu to age of chivalry (killed all the *POWS* too).
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F22    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History--Ehran   2/4/2005 11:16:43 PM
I consider Midway an upset because the Japanese should have won a big victory. The Combined Fleet was bigger, more experienced, and had yet to be beaten by the US Navy---not counting Coral Sea, which was a strategic loss, but a tactical victory for the Japanese. We were darn lucky at Midway, nothwithstanding the great decoding work by Rochefort & staff, the quick repair of the Yorktown, and Nimitz's bold move to ambush the Japanese.
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jarkeld    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History--Ehran   2/5/2005 3:42:53 AM
Hard to say what biggest upset of last hundred years. We have to mention Isreal versus the Arabs are were skipping a couple of huge upsets. North Vietnam is clearly the biggest upset US has ever had. Stalingrad I really dont see why germans were unable to take this city. Seems that they simply were not prepared for urban warfare at all. Midway is one of those battles that was decided on luck where if chance had just moved a few peaces of the puzzle outcome would have been totaly different.
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F22    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History---Stalingrad   2/5/2005 6:45:19 PM
I think the big upset about Stalingrad was not the outcome, but that it was even fought at all. The thrust towards the Don and Volga lacked the usual German aggresiveness, and it cost the Germans an opportunity to take Stalingrad in July 1942 with hardly a fight.
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hiSTORY    RE:Greatest Military Upset in History    2/10/2005 10:40:01 PM
The greatest military upsets in history has to be Alexander's victory over Darius III and the Persians in the Battle of Guagamela in 331 BC, hands down!!!
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Sans Souci       6/7/2010 4:20:31 AM
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Photon       6/7/2010 3:36:37 PM
Some other 'greatest upsets' that I could think of right now ...
1.  The abrupt halt of Mongol advance into Europe in the 13th century.  I would say this is among the 'greatest upsets', because it was not a result of someone stopping the Mongols, but the Mongols stopping themselves due to their internal political snag while there were no one in the Continental Europe capable of out-fighting the Mongols at that time.  (Ogodei, their khagan, had passed away and thus marked the beginning of fracturing of the Mongol Empire.)  The Mongols never came back.
2.  The abrupt halt of Chinese naval expedition in the early Ming Dynasty.  Similar to the Mongols, they were not stopped due to military reasons, but due to a political one.  (Eunuchs and non-Han officials vs. Han court officials.)  The first European transoceanic attempt was still half a century away.  Not only the Chinese stopped, they soon scrapped their navy.
3.  The Chinese intervention phase of the Korean War.  PRC did not keep its intention secret at all.  They have repeatedly threatened to intervene.  Furthermore, once the Chinese started sending in troops (in October 1950), South Korean officers were alarmed by Chinese prisoners taken as they advanced towards the Yalu River.  But all these signs were ignored by McArther & Co.  The UN forces were routed during the worst of the winter of '50-'51 and it went so badly that they had to abandon Seoul.  Among the most extreme swings of generalship of the 20th century -- McArthur was nothing short of awesome only a little while ago when he pulled off Inchon landing.  Once the Chinese were on the loose, he was never able to recover, although his successor, Ridgeway, was able to step in and turn things around just in time.
4.  The Russian blunders before and during the Russo-Japanese War (1904 - 05).  Even the prepatory part of this war went badly wrong.  Among other things, they not only assisted the Japanese by deploying their Baltic Fleet to the Pacific (thousands of nautical miles of worth of re-deployment is exhausting as hell!), but also botched by having to discharge their wireless telegram operators.  (These wireless operators were German civilians and they had to be discharged at Madagascar as they refused to be put under military discipline, but the Russians were critically short of wireless operators of their own.)  The Russians also botched diplomatically -- Japan was backed by an alliance with Great Britain at that time, and other major powers like the US was also weary of Russian expansionism.  Additional blunder -- Jewish financiers were also supportive of the Japanese at that time as Russia's pogroms have outraged quite a number of Jewish activists and intellectuals.  The financial support angle turned out just as important as Japan's treasury was rather poor compared to that of Russia.
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