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Subject: What is the best way for the US to secure her borders?
JohnBarry    9/20/2004 12:52:59 PM
What is the best way for the US to secure her borders? What kind of force would it take to make US borders reasonably secure? How much manpower? Would you have a massive increase in the Border Patrol or create new military units for the role? How would you equip and organize the force. Would it be a standard light infantry, airmobile, mechanized, even old horse cavalry?
 
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terrain21u    RE:What is the best way for the US to secure her borders?   9/20/2004 8:35:44 PM
I don't think there is a way to completely secure the US borders. Anyone with a reasonable amount of determination can find a way across. Some extra money invested in the border patrol and some extra manpower wouldn't hurt necessarily, but I don't think it would have an overwhelming impact. I think using military forces as border guards in the US is a mistake. There is a disparity in the duties of one and the other.
 
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Roman    RE:What is the best way for the US to secure her borders?   9/20/2004 8:55:12 PM
That depends exactly against what you want to secure your borders against and how inhumane you are willing to be. If you REALLY wanted to secure your borders and do it cheaply, but inhumanely, you could use landmines. U.S. has millions of landmines in storage and they will probably be destroyed if they are not used, so this would be extremely cheap. Unfortunately, it would also be rather inhumane because of the gruesome casualties it would cause to those who tried to cross the border. Another way would be to build a fence/wall, but this would also be politically difficult, although it would not be inhumane like the landmines option. Short of the above inhuman way of using landmines and the politically difficult wall, the best and much more human way to secure the border is to decrease the human flow accross it, because fewer crossings are easier to deal with for the border patrol. This can be achieved by disrupting the incentive for the crossings in the first place. That is not so difficult to do at all. The police could stage widespread checks of employers to see whether they employ illegal immigrants and deport those that are found, while fining the employers heftily. This would be an expensive effort at first, but it would quickly lead to unnacceptable risks for both dishonest employers and the illlegal immigrants they hire and the practice would decline massively, which would in turn make it easier to enforce, which would cause further declines, etc. It would be a virtuous circle. With much fewer people crossing the borders, the border patrol would have a significantly easier job and any terrorists who tried to cross would not be overlooked in the sea of economic illegal migrants.
 
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human7    Good Article   9/25/2004 1:12:15 PM
 
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human7    Funny Email   9/25/2004 1:21:51 PM
A friend of mine sent me this email: Go Try This, Go Ahead - I Dare You! If you have a Death Wish! Enter Mexico illegally. Never mind immigration quotas, visas, international law, or any of that nonsense. Once there, demand that the local government provide free medical care for you and your entire family. Demand bilingual nurses and doctors. Demand free bilingual local government forms, bulletins, etc. Procreate abundantly, regardless of whether or not you afford to have children. Deflect any criticism of this allegedly irresponsible reproductive behavior with, "It is a cultural United States thing. You would not understand, pal." Keep your American identity strong. Fly Old Glory from your rooftop, or proudly display it in your front window or on your car bumper. Speak only English at home and in public and insist that your children do likewise. Demand classes on American culture in the Mexican school system. Demand a local Mexican driver license. This will afford other legal rights and will go far to legitimize your unauthorized, illegal, presence in Mexico. Insist that local Mexican law enforcement teach English to all its officers. Good luck! It will not happen in Mexico or any other country in the world... Except right here in America. God Bless America Enter Mexico illegally. Never mind immigration quotas, visas, international law, or any of that nonsense. Once there, demand that the local government provide free medical care for you and your entire family. Demand bilingual nurses and doctors. Demand free bilingual local government forms, bulletins, etc. Procreate abundantly. Deflect any criticism of this allegedly irresponsible reproductive behavior with,"It is a cultural United States thing. You would not understand, pal." Keep your American identity strong. Fly Old Glory from your rooftop, or proudly display it in your front window or on your car bumper. Speak only English at home and in public and insist that your children do likewise. Demand classes on American culture in the Mexican school system. Demand a local Mexican driver license. This will afford other legal rights and will go far to legitimize your unauthorized, illegal, presence in Mexico. Insist that local Mexican law enforcement teach English to all its officers. Good luck! It will not happen in Mexico or any other country in the world... Except right here. God Bless America
 
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glenponder    RE:Funny Email   9/25/2004 2:28:24 PM
the really funny thing is that in the uk there are articals like that in the papers all the time. there are even a couple of serbs suing the MOD for compensation from when thay got wounded atfer fireing guns on a british patrol in serbia. the british fired back. after the serbs were wounded they were flown to the uk treated for there wounds on the NHS. they stayed claimed benefits and are on LEGAL AID. so technicaly the british taxpayers are paying for the MOD to be sued for there healthcare and there house. on second thoughts i might have to enter the green card lotto at the top of this page LOL
 
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human7    Another Good Article   9/25/2004 3:32:14 PM
 
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Kadett    Not inhumane to use land mines   9/26/2004 2:02:41 AM
Provided that the US put up warnings, in Spanish and English, that there are minefields, the sole fault lies upon those stupid enough to try and cross anyhow. As every nation has the right to secure their own borders, the US is well within its rights to mine the Mexican border..
 
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   RE:Not inhumane to use land mines   9/26/2004 2:18:41 AM
Thats a beautiful idea Kadett - sew the border with bouncing bettys and leave the shredded corpses of mexican babies for the vultures and the news cameras. Next!!
 
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human7    From the mouth of a Federal Agent   9/26/2004 4:12:16 PM
I proposed this question the following questions to a friend of mine in the Homeland Security. What is the best way for the US to secure her borders? Right now, in your opinion, what is the Border Patrols biggest obstacle? Here was his reply: Use the military...that's what they are there for. Well, one might ask,why can't the Border Patrol handle the problem. I will answer that question at the same time I answer your second question below: POLITICS. The Patrol will never have the ability to do their job as long as they are used as a political pawn. We do not have the manpower, funding, etc, but most important, the political backing. In sum, the politicians want to talk big about "border security", but god forbid they piss off any Hispanic voters. We were basically like everyone else down there: "players in a game". I always felt that the Military,with their numbers and equipment, would act as more of a deterrent down there, but it will never happen. Whenever a Border Patrol Agent killed a smuggler, the headlines would read "Migrant worker murdered by Patrol Agent". That kind of opinion has become the norm on the SW border. Half the that goes on down there (including Patrol Agents getting killed) hardly even makes the newspaper....it's old news...nobody cares down there anymore. BUT...BUT, as a politician, you could imagine the headlines if a National Guardsmen shot a in tonk down there: "US Army's War on Mexico Claims First Migrant".
 
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joe6pack    RE:From the mouth of a Federal Agent   9/26/2004 10:11:45 PM
"Use the military...that's what they are there for." That is a horrible reply from someone associated with Homeland Security. I'd strongly argue that is NOT what the military is for, unless people start trying to sneak across the border in tanks. Do you really want to look like old Easy Germany or North Korea? Land mines, concertina, and anyone that hops the fence gets the buisness end of an assault rifle? I agree that our legal system is screwed up when it comes to illegal immigration... Frankly, I think the easiest sollution would be to make "legal" immigration easier.. anyone who wants to come here get a job and pay taxes, more power to them. Maybe use the extra income to put some more radiation detectors at US ports. if you are worried about securing US borders.
 
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