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Subject: .357 SIG
longrifle    6/26/2006 2:27:27 AM
Anybody use it, and what do you think of it? I've got two .40 Glocks and I'm considering buying a .357 SIG barrel for one of them. I've read that some people think it recoils a little "snappy," but the .40 does too and I really don't have any problem with that. Also, does anyone know if it's safe to use a .357 SIG barrel in a first generation Glock Model 22? The pistol is in good condition mechanically, but I bought it second hand and I don't know how many rounds have been through it.
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buzzard    RE:.357 SIG Question...Buzzard   6/29/2006 10:33:29 AM
Actually I haven't shot a .357 SIG yet. I say yet because a buddy of mine actually bought one a while back and hasn't gotten off his lazy duff and tried it yet. I have to keep badgering him about it, since I do want to try the caliber. I have tried a .38 Super which, I believe, is rougly comparable in performance. It was controllable. It's a bit less oomph than a .357 magnum. I imagine it could have overpenetration issues depending on the round used. I haven't seen any articles on it in gun magazines lately. It may well have fallen out of fashion already. Seems like the current popular round for hyping is the .45 GAP (Glock Auto Pistol), which is a shortened .45 cartrige designed for smaller carry pistols. buzzard
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DarthAmerica    Buzzard   6/29/2006 11:41:51 AM
Honestly I don't see anything which contradicts my statement. Of course shot placement is key. You're not going to kill someone shooting off a pinky. Thanks for the expert tip there. However for a given placement of the shot, a bigger hole is more lethal. I don't see how you could dispute that. I'm not trying to contradict you. But I've actually used this and even bigger rounds. I'm telling you that against a HUMAN TARGET the miniscule differences in performance between this or that bullet is such that its not going to matter how big the bullet is within reason as long as you have good shot placement. A bigger hole isnt always more lethal. Much more important than how big the hole is is how deep and how well the given bullet is able to penetrate bone, xfer energy, retain mass, reliably pass through barriers such as clothing AND give consistent performance ect. There are so many varibles and so little difference between "standard defensive pistol/revolver calibers" wound ballistics that which one you use doesnt really matter after certain calibers. In other words its statistically insignificant.
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longrifle    Oops!   6/29/2006 12:32:34 PM
I think I've opened a can of worms here, and all I really wanted to know was: 1)Have you shot it and what did you think of it? 2)Is a drop-in barrel safe to use on an older G22? You know, the first generation model without the fingergrooves and light rails.
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buzzard    RE:Oops!   6/29/2006 12:43:07 PM
"1)Have you shot it and what did you think of it?" Not yet, but if I can get my friend off his butt to let me, I will report. I have shot comparable autos though. They aren't much trouble. "2)Is a drop-in barrel safe to use on an older G22? You know, the first generation model without the fingergrooves and light rails." Safety wise you will be fine as the drop in barrel will certainly be able to handle the pressure. Guns these days are well overengineered. Now if you fire it a lot it might be rough on the frame, but I doubt it. You should be fine. buzzard
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DarthAmerica    RE:Oops! - LR   6/29/2006 1:37:27 PM
No I think we have addressed the issues. As a P229 owner I can tell you its a cool round. More snappy recoil vs 9mm or .40 S&W but not at all uncontrollable. Also the sound of the weapon is distinctive. People next to you will peek over to see what you are shooting as it makes a nice BOOM! Accuracy from the Sig is awesome too! In regard to your Glock, 9mm will work perfectly fine from a safety point of view. I just always accompany such advice with reference to the manufacturer as a force of habit and to encourage safety. But the .357 Sig and .40 S&W generate higher chamber pressures and work the gun harder than 9mm. You might want to make sure the recoil spring is compatible though. Other than that your all good.
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Horsesoldier    RE:.357 SIG Question...Cato   6/29/2006 8:50:10 PM
>>What does .357 SIG bring to the table that good quality, +P 9x19, or .40S&W ammo dosen't. Not talking ****, I really don't know.<< In my world . . . nothing much. But, I'd also note that I'm pretty exclusively a 9mm and 45 ACP sort of guy when it comes to handguns, and unlike many, don't have problems/reservations about 9x19 as a defensive caliber. The idea, as others noted, was to match ballistics of 357 Magnum defensive loads in a reasonably sized semi-auto handgun. You don't get a lot of improvement over +P 9mm defensive loads, though there's some. I don't think it would make much difference at real world handgun engagement range unless you were trying to shoot through some sort of barrier, when I'd give it an edge over 9x19. If I was somebody who went with the bullet performance school of self-defense over the shot placement/repeat as necessary school, I'd probably just opt for the bigger hole provided by 40S&W, 45 ACP or 10mm.
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longrifle    RE:.357 SIG Question...Cato   6/29/2006 10:54:04 PM
>>I don't think it would make much difference at real world handgun engagement range unless you were trying to shoot through some sort of barrier, when I'd give it an edge over 9x19.<< I'm guessing that's the reason it's becoming popular with highway patrol agencies. There's a high probability that barriers will exist in any shooting a trooper is involved in. Doors, windshields, you get the picture. There's also a slight probability that a trooper might be called upon to attempt a longer pistol shot than a municipal cop. The .357 SIG is a flat shooting round by pistol standards.
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Cato    RE:.357 SIG Question...Horsesoldier   6/30/2006 12:26:05 AM
I came across a report published by the FBI in 1989 (I think you've referenced it in another thread?) that stated that the criteria for pistol lethality was first, 12+ inches of penetration in ballistic geletain and second, diameter of the bullet. Is this still the accepted ballistic model? Thanks, Cato
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DarthAmerica    RE:.357 SIG Question...Cato   6/30/2006 1:08:27 AM
Is this still the accepted ballistic model? Yes P.S. Range Day 2morrow
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Cato    RE:.357 SIG Question...Darth   6/30/2006 1:59:18 AM
"P.S. Range Day 2morrow" You lucky, lucky bastard. Hittin up LAX? BTW how's the FN 57 working out for you? Have a goodun', Cato
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