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Subject: M1A2 vs Leopard1
DropBear    10/31/2004 12:09:54 AM
Could a solitary M1A2 Abrams survive a hypothetical engagement with two Leopard1 tanks working together? Irrespective of ground terrain conditions (desert, woodlands etc), does the Abrams have a marked advantage in sensors, weapons range etc, to defeat two Leopard1's ???
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boris the romanian    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   10/31/2004 12:15:07 AM
"two Leopard1's " Which models? The Canadian Leopard IA5s had a very good sensor/FCS suite, and they were massively uparmoured. From under 1000m, the L-7 would have a fair chance of penetrating even the Abrams' frontal armour (as does the 2A46M), so terrain is a major factor. But commiting so fine an MBT as the M1 in ones or twos instead of at company or battalion level is military blasphemy.
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gf0012-aust    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   10/31/2004 12:41:05 AM
Against a current spec Aussie Leo1? If yes, then my money is on the M1. Hence the reason why Oz Leo1's were not deployed to Iraq. There were concerns about survivability. At the arse end of the M1's gun range they would be floundering around like wingless ducks.
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jarkeld    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   10/31/2004 9:07:44 AM
With clear line of fire a M1 could down A whole flock of leopards before they got into fireing range. On other hand if A leopard was able to hide and wait tell M1 was within it range then 1 leopard would be enough to kill a M1. It comes down to fact that M1 is much better on the attack while Leopards still have use as defensive tanks.
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Seeker    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   10/31/2004 4:12:23 PM
If the Troops are well elite one Leopard 1 could defeat two M-1A2s.
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Jeffrey    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/1/2004 4:39:28 AM
Thats true. Especially Canadian Leopard1A5 (C2) rews, they seem to be very capable.
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Yimmy    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/1/2004 7:24:13 AM
Does Canada have plans to replace their old tanks??
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Jeffrey    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/1/2004 8:13:03 AM
Don't think so, they are probably gonna replace them with wheeled vehicles with 105mm gun like Belgium did...
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datM1TC    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/3/2004 6:08:22 PM
I thought the Canadians were going to replace their Leopards with Strykers.
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fullamongo    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/3/2004 6:15:35 PM
That would be a wheeled vehicle with a 105mm gun. It's a shame they're losing their tanks.
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datM1TC    RE:M1A2 vs Leopard1   11/3/2004 6:25:08 PM
DropBear:- There is a scenario in M1 individual tank crew gunnery qualification in which the M1 crew engages a stationary hulldown tank target, a fully exposed stationary tank target, a moving tank target and an RPG team. Some tank crews take as much as 40 seconds to do all this, but get a poor score. Well-trained tank crews can eliminate all 4 targets with less than 30 seconds of exposure time. It is a defensive engagement, in which the M1 crew starts out in a turret-down position, with only the sights and laser on the roof of the turret exposed. Two-target engagements in tank crew gunnery are considered simple and routine. We even train to engage two targets in "degraded" mode, without lasers or thermal sights, using only purely optical sights and rapid visual calculation of range based on target size. As a long-time M1 gunner and tank commander, I can attest that it's pretty simple, maybe a 10 or 15-second exposure time for both targets, if the crew is well-trained and working well together. So, to answer your question, I believe that yes, an M1 could engage and destroy 2 Leopard tanks, even using only optical sights and without laser range-finding equipment. Or 2 of any other kind of tank am M1 might find itself up against.
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