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Subject: Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle
Kozzy    9/22/2004 9:32:38 PM
Might as well start wanking about IFVs. So what do you think is the best IFV out there? I would go for the CV9040, I like the big gun.
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doggtag    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 2:49:46 AM
I'd like to see just how formidable the Polish (yes, Poland) BWP2000 is. From a Jane's Armour and Artillery, it supposedly was fitted from 1997 with the OTO T60/70A turret with a single TOW launcher either side of the turret. The Warrior will finally get itself a decent set of teeth when it gets the CTA International 40mm turret (the CTA 40 will boast slightly better performance than the 40mm Bofors gun of the CV9040.) And the Japanese Type 89 is armed with the hard-hitting 35mm Oerlikon KDE cannon and a pair of Jyu-MAT (TOW equivalent) ATGMs. The BMP-3 is interesting to note that in addition to its 30mm 2A72 gun, it also sports a coaxial 100mm 2A70 smoothbore low-pressure gun that can fire HE support rounds and the 100mm 9M117 (AT-10 Stabber) laser guided ATGM. The thing here is, the 100mm round does not have the punch of heavier ATGMs with the capability to rip through heavy armor with ERA, but the round is overkill against lighter vehicles which are more than capable of being dealt with by the 30mm gun. The only real benefit being, the round has pinpoint accuracy out to just over 4000m. It is interesting that the US Bradley fighting vehicle has been tested with the Bushmaster family of guns up to the 50mm Mk 3, but the US still only opts for the 25mm gun. This is especially interesting because most others are now opting for 30mm minimally. With the USMC's new AAAV mounting a potent 30mm gun which fires the same family of ammo of the A-10's GAU-8 30mm Avenger cannon, it will be interesting to see if the USMC opts to up the gun on LAV-25s to the 30mm gun also (especially considering the vehicle only mounts the gun, and not a "combo" turret like the BFV with its twin TOW pod.) Several nations have tested heavier guns on their IFVs than what their production vehicles currently have, and it will be interesting to see just how big IFV guns get in the next couple decades, especially if they do not mount ATGM systems with them. MBT-killing guns are easily fitted, anything from 76mm, 90mm, 105mm, even 120mm low recoil guns. But as bigger guns are fitted, the correspondingly larger ammo will start encroaching on crew space, and they may not be able to hold a full squad anymore if they start carrying the big guns. And at that point, they have become light tanks.. .
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boris the romanian    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 3:29:14 AM
I think a BMP-3 with a roof mounted Khrizantema launcher instead of the gun-launched missile would rank as one of the world's best. The 2A42/72 gun can deal with any armour short of an MBT and the Khrizantema would tear apart any MBT accross the frontal arc. Even in the unlikely event that a first rate MBT like LeoII or Abrams would survive a hit accross the front, it would most probably be "sanitized", all of its electronics/external sensors and optics very seriously damaged. What the 2A70 would prove useful for is as a bunker buster and as a standard artillry piece in the "field gun" role. A 100mm HE-FRAG round is extremely unhealthy to nearby infantry, and very decent against other soft targets as well. I think it's good to have the flexibility. The BMP-3 has very good mobility, and unlike the M-2, it is amphibious without any preparation. If amphibious ops aren't required the BMP-3 can very easily mount an applique armour package, of both Russian and Western origin. I don't know about the Westerm/Israeli stuff, but the Russian applique armour consists of ceramic plates sandwiched between titanium-reinforced steel (the arrangement goes steel-ceramic plate-rubber-titanium). The whole kit adds about eight tonnes to the BMP-3's weight but it greatly improves protection.
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PuckaMan    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 4:02:05 AM
The BMP3 is a fine vehicle. Bloody cramped for the on board crunchies, though. Ummm....... I don't know. The Cv90 is nice, but so is the new German IFV being developed...... I'll need to think about this a bit. Pucka
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Kozzy    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 7:46:49 AM
I've always wondered, doesn't all that 100mm ammo explode when hit, killing everyone?
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B.Smitty    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 8:28:59 AM
Kozzy wrote: "So what do you think is the best IFV out there?" Best for what and for whom?
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AlbanyRifles    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 9:46:51 AM
I am sure this comes as no surprise to anyone, but I'll take the M2A2 Bradley. While there may be more capable guns than the 25mm, you get tremendous "bang for the buck" from that APFSDS-T round...not to mention you can carry a lot of them. The thermals are excellent, coax is excellent (thank you Fabrique National!) and there is sufficient room in the back. Armor good, speed is fantastic!!! Oh yeah its battle tested.....and very survivable. Remember that BFV that got hit by a car bomb about 10 days ago? The entire squad was back at their base camp about 4 hours after getting autographs from a visiting American sports star. Not bad for a design which is 25 years old.
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Kozzy    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle   9/23/2004 10:06:39 AM
For carrying a supporting infantry.
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B.Smitty    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle - AlbanyRifles   9/23/2004 1:08:53 PM
AlbanyRifles wrote: "I am sure this comes as no surprise to anyone, but I'll take the M2A2 Bradley." Not the A3?
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B.Smitty    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle - Kozzy    9/23/2004 1:09:32 PM
For what country?
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joe6pack    RE:Best Infantry Fighting Vehicle - AlbanyRifles   9/23/2004 1:52:08 PM
"Not the A3?" - The A3 is just the calvary version. I think the only difference is that it packs more ammo than troops.
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