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Subject: What are the top 10 most powerful nations ( not largerst )
The Warrior    8/19/2005 1:35:27 PM
1) United States of America 2) People's Republic of China 3) Russian Federation 4) Republic of India 5) Islamic Republic of Pakistan 6) United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland 7) Republic of France 8) Federal Republic of Germany 9) Republic of South Korea 10) Federative Republic of Brazil
 
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JTR~~    we are getting there   3/14/2010 6:39:04 AM

Here's my list then:

 

 

1) USA (by most factors number 1, it has the most allies, military and economy, a great geographic positions, but it lacks some will however)

2) China (the future economic superpower, it has will, it lacks allies and military strength)

3) Japan (I have some faith they might snap out of their funk of not having babies by 2050... they were never fully liberal otherwise anyway)

4) Russia (Though sometimes incompetently and often corrupt and in many ways worsening atm, their leadership is at least actively trying to reverse the population decline unlike Japan's ideas of bullying Hikikomori around. If Russia can keep the east (easy) and get to 200 million (hard) it will be a force to reckon with)

5) Mexico (she is maturing quickly)

6) Poland (her too, but her geographic position is less ideal and she has less people and resources)

7) India (she's big, but not very good at stuff)

8) Brazil (growing up economically, but politically very immature)

9) United Kingdom (smaller than France, but more talented, has less muslims and is more willing)

10) Germany

11) France (less people and talent and position than Germany, but has more will)



i still think people are undervaluing British capability, seeing as they have the 2nd largest power projection capability in NATO, and the largest power projection capability in europe i would rank them in the top three (also given their close relations with america). again brazil has been mentioned, yes they are growing, but they need to sort out internal affairs first (thats not likely to happen for some time), and i dont think they have the political or military force (yes big army, effectively proven? nope), same with mexico i believe. polands an interesting one, that hasnt been mentioned before (i like poland http://www.strategypage.com/CuteSoft_Client/CuteEditor/Images/emsmile.gif" alt="" />), but they simply have no political power, especially when they are dominated by strong neighbours like germany etc.
thats all i have to say ( i think britian should be at the top up there with america, only america could destroy Britain without using all their size such as china, india)
 
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JTR~~    Bias   3/17/2010 1:08:57 PM

.  Nobody with any intelligence can say that the US ground forces especially the infantry are second to anyone. 




bias if i ever heard it, European armies have a far greater track record, the most experienced of all the European forces must either be the British and the French or Germany, secondly it is frankly absurd to claim that an army the size of Americas even with all its resources can train its troops to the same/better standard than those in a smaller force such as Britain, France, Germany, Israel, Canada etc (basically smaller armies), hence when trying to teach a student at college there must be a certain number of pupils to teaching staff which students aren?t taught in classes of a thousand at a time, the same applies to training an armed force

 
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cwDeici       3/17/2010 9:45:57 PM




Here's my list then:



 



 



1) USA (by most factors number 1, it has the most allies, military and economy, a great geographic positions, but it lacks some will however)



2) China (the future economic superpower, it has will, it lacks allies and military strength)



3) Japan (I have some faith they might snap out of their funk of not having babies by 2050... they were never fully liberal otherwise anyway)



4) Russia (Though sometimes incompetently and often corrupt and in many ways worsening atm, their leadership is at least actively trying to reverse the population decline unlike Japan's ideas of bullying Hikikomori around. If Russia can keep the east (easy) and get to 200 million (hard) it will be a force to reckon with)



5) Mexico (she is maturing quickly)



6) Poland (her too, but her geographic position is less ideal and she has less people and resources)



7) India (she's big, but not very good at stuff)



8) Brazil (growing up economically, but politically very immature)



9) United Kingdom (smaller than France, but more talented, has less muslims and is more willing)



10) Germany



11) France (less people and talent and position than Germany, but has more will)








i still think people are undervaluing British capability, seeing as they have the 2nd largest power projection capability in NATO, and the largest power projection capability in europe i would rank them in the top three (also given their close relations with america). again brazil has been mentioned, yes they are growing, but they need to sort out internal affairs first (thats not likely to happen for some time), and i dont think they have the political or military force (yes big army, effectively proven? nope), same with mexico i believe. polands an interesting one, that hasnt been mentioned before (i like poland http://www.strategypage.com/CuteSoft_Client/CuteEditor/Images/emsmile.gif" alt="" />), but they simply have no political power, especially when they are dominated by strong neighbours like germany etc.

thats all i have to say ( i think britian should be at the top up there with america, only america could destroy Britain without using all their size such as china, india)



 
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cwDeici    PC Error - Yes. Britain is the second most powerful force on the planet. However I am factoring in steep declines and ascents still in effect. Conside   3/17/2010 9:50:54 PM
 
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cwDeici       3/17/2010 9:51:59 PM
... consider it a list for 2050 if you will, and even though European nations mentioned will still be stronger fighters pound for pound.
 
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JTR~~    i shall view it your way   3/18/2010 1:13:40 PM

... consider it a list for 2050 if you will, and even though European nations mentioned will still be stronger fighters pound for pound.

in this case then i still disagree with the placement of Britain, as you have correctly put it wil be further down the list than it is at the moment but i will be higher up than where you have placed it (this is a personal opinion of my own), i believe that it will at the very least still be within the top five, poland will not overtake it any time soon as you have put, neither will Brazil they are simply far too weak, im still unconvinced by japan, but if you can prove to me that it is very powerful then i will happily listen, also i would like to hear your views on why Britain should be ranked so low, agan ill be happy to listen

 
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wesuet    little baby   7/7/2010 7:56:34 AM
Such a foolish German.
Look at ur country and then comment.
 
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AThousandYoung       7/13/2010 7:15:18 PM
I'm surprised I haven't seen any mention of the Turks.  Don't they have an immense military in addition to their tremendous strategically geographic and diplomatic position?
 
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Panther       7/13/2010 10:01:59 PM

I'm surprised I haven't seen any mention of the Turks.  Don't they have an immense military in addition to their tremendous strategically geographic and diplomatic position?

Compared too whom? The US, Russia, China or even India? No. The Turks have a fine military tradition, but it is not immensely powerful as you suggest.
 
Geographical, strategical and diplomatic position, yes it is important, most especially from a US standpoint and for historical reasons, the Russian standpoint. However, if the US has indeed squandered many a things as it's critics constantly love too point out, then the Turks, under Erdogan, are themselves, quickly following and over shadowing the US example in alleged missteps, by itself in also constantly alienating their long time allies, including ironically and most importantly the US.
 

 
 

 
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cwDeici       7/14/2010 10:17:44 AM


in this case then i still disagree with the placement of Britain, as you have correctly put it wil be further down the list than it is at the moment but i will be higher up than where you have placed it (this is a personal opinion of my own), i believe that it will at the very least still be within the top five, poland will not overtake it any time soon as you have put, neither will Brazil they are simply far too weak, im still unconvinced by japan, but if you can prove to me that it is very powerful then i will happily listen, also i would like to hear your views on why Britain should be ranked so low, agan ill be happy to listen


This was half a year ago, so I've changed my opinions somewhat. I agree with you more now, if you are reading this/still around the forum.
I still hold the same opinion on Japan though, they have great problems with their demographics and their willpower and unlike Russia are not doing enough to reverse their demographic decline, but their navy is very strong and their economic base remains huge.
 
My list now, based partially on limited future potential, or say, roughly raw power in 2050 would be:
 
1) USA (strongest militarily, technologically and has access to resources at home and aborad and plenty of allies but also responsibilities (It has an Empire of Trust... google it :D))
2) China (will be economically equal or stronger than the US and improving, few allies)
3) Russia (Japan's population may have fallen below Russia's at this point and while I still believe Japan will be more economically powerful and stronger on the sea Russia's vast resources will give it diplomatic and industrial leverage, some allies)
4) Japan (strong navy and economy, by now severely reduced demographics but perhaps has managed to reverse them for the next generation, also it lacks resources, good number of allies)
5) United Kingdom (smaller than France and less talented then Germany (economically), but more talented than France and better overall fighters than Germany (strategically and tactically in the sea and air), has less muslims and is more willing)
6) Germany (very thrifty, but has still got psychological issues, and not just war-issues... may be behind in numerous industries it considers unethical like genetic manipulation and nuclear power, good number of allies but can be very obnoxious about wars though in a more polite manner than France)
7) France (larger than the UK but generally weaker than both the above neighbors in most aspects except will, has a good number of allies but is generally liked a bit less for exceptionalist reasons) 
8) Mexico (will probably have cleaned up its drug-based insurgencies and has a rapidly growing economy and a wonderfully safe and economically strategic Atlantic-Pacific position like the US, a fair number of allies, and very close to the US which is extremely helpful as long as nothing insane happens in the US politically)
9) India (rather incompetent overall and few allies miraculously, but she's been getting a bit better lately and her sheer size is daunting)
10) Poland (far more competent than Mexico and without an insurgency, built most of the Russian navy according to my friend here, but has a much smaller population and a less optimal geography, its also true what you said that they are dominated by neighbors like Germany)
11) Brazil (Lula is an idiot and as I research more it seems sadly enough to reflect on his country, is making friends with France which is good but something they should be hedging with another major western nation.... not Iran and refusing to recognize Honduras like Chavez after everyone else has) 
 
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