GOP: Read up on Mogadishu, Baghdad, and Fallujah...maybe then you won't sound so ignorant. Mogadishu? Isn't that the place where the US 'peacekeeping' forces turned the whole city against them following a botched assassination attempt? Baghdad? Fallujah? Do they really fall into the same category? FISH (Fighting In Someone's House) is pretty sucky, AFAICT, but does it require the same intestinal fortitude as places like Hurtgen Forest, Aachen, Omaha Beach or the Cities across S. Vietnam during the Tet Offensive? Bravery has its place, but professionalism will win more wars at lesser cost.

>"Bravery has its place, but professionalism will win more wars at lesser cost."< True to a extent, and I believe the US soldiers, especially soldiers who have seen combat, are professional. They have to be, or they get killed. While we did use alot of firepower in Fallujah, for example, our guys still had to manually clear houses with insurgents in them. Not only does that take bravery, it also takes professionalism. There is no great technological answer to clearing a house. It takes training and bravery. Now, as far as relying only on professionalism with no bravery, you will lose alot of wars. France did this is WWII. Relying on pure bravery will also get you beat, as Japan lost in WWII.

>"Wouldnt underestimate the Russkies, they pushed into Kosovo right under our noses a few years ago."< I don't underestimate them, I just don't think they are better than we are. >"As for those 1000 dead in Somalia, how many were from 5.56, and how many were from miniguns and rockets from the helos?"< Probably close to 300-500. Yes, we had the little bird, but we had limited air support. >"Now, as far as relying only on professionalism with no bravery, you will lose alot of wars. France did this is WWII. Relying on pure bravery will also get you beat, as Japan lost in WWII."< Sorry, I know some will be mad about this, but I am not 100% wrong

Bravery is an individual thing, not a national phenomanon.

Her is a little bit of Trivia about the the UK highest Military Honour, the Victoria Cross. When this medal was created the original inscription was to read For Bravery", Queen Victoria insisted this be changed to "For Valour" saying she did not want anyone to think that the only brave men were those who won that award, "All her men were brave" In the Measure of respect section is the full citation for the latest recipient of this award, suggest you read it.

>"Bravery is an individual thing, not a national phenomanon"< Not totally true. Several things go into being brave. Alot of it is your nations culture (the Japanese, for example), alot of it is Patriotism (the USA, for example), and alot of it is training, alot of it is personal convictions (am I doing the right thing), and alot of it is cirumstances (Chosin, Bastogne, etc).

Sorry for so many posts, I just can't seem to write down everything I want to say :) I think that even though a nation might not have the best trained army, extraordinory men step up when it is necessary. I am not just talking about America, I am talking about any nation. the Russians at Stalingrad the British during the Battle of Britain the 7th cavalry (US) at the Ia Drang valley the USMC at Iwo Jima and Okinawa

Absolutely, those are the guys that get the medals, mostly posthumasely however ;)

We must not confuse Bravery with Training . My little list : Top ONE : the Legionnaire ~whatever Nationality he is , even American . Then : -Gurkhas -Germans -Indians -French -Tcheck -British -Russian -Japaneses -Spanish -Finns is more about "Attitude" than Training . I am talking Attitude when facing adversity in general . Then if you are "Brave" WITH "Attitude" , you 're a Leader . Actually from my personal experience in combat , real Leaders are very few . A real Leader has no place in my list as he can be of ANY nationality . Can you see my point now ? Basicaly , my list is about people who doesn 't "brake" easily , them being alone or in groups . Cheers .

If we are talking attitude, please drop Spain from your list. These guys ran away from the insurgents in Iraq. They don't deserve to be on the list with the likes of Britain and others. The Legionairres are special ops, not infantry, so the might need to be dropped :) . The Japanese haven't proven themselves in 60 years, so they might need to be dropped, or have a (?) beside them. Who is Tcheck? Your new list (with my edits)... -Gurkhas -Germans -Indians -French -Tcheck -British -Russian -Finns -USA (Hooah) -Irish