The French

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fall out RE:Not really... 1/15/2004 5:52:24 PM

haha, umm, yer, its called in a hurry and sms language (which is now an official language). ;) besides tht really is besides the point mate.

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fall out RE:Not really... 1/15/2004 5:55:28 PM

evlstu r u american? just wondering, no offence if you are (although i dont really know you) but what i said still stands. im not saying all americans are, tht's just stupid but...

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evlstu RE:Not really... 1/16/2004 4:53:47 AM

Does it matter?

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fall out RE:Not really... 1/16/2004 6:35:53 PM

it does for most ppl on this web site (not saying u.. as yet ;) ). as they are biased towards their own country and tend to overlook facts that point in the other direction.

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sentinel28a RE:Not really... 1/17/2004 6:58:07 AM

Are you surprised? Nationalism brings out the best and worst in people. There are people on this board whose grasp of geopolitics is more akin to watching Dragonball Z than reading Sun Tzu or Clausewitz. I'm not going to get on some soapbox and say that I'm unbiased; I try to be, but few things raise my hackles faster than some moron posting "HAHAHA BUSH SUX AMERICA SUX LOL". It's one of the reasons I no longer post on Fark. Explaining why the US Corps of Cadets at West Point couldn't shoot down the WTC hijackers on 9/11 gets pretty boring after the sixth time. Yes, we Americans do tend to be arrogant at times, and usually exceptionalist. That's due to many of the Founding Fathers tracing their roots back to Puritanism and "the house on the hill." They had the world's first modern functioning republic, in a day of monarchies and dictatorships. So naturally they were pretty proud of the fact. That's worked its way into the fabric of American history, world view, and life. We conquered a continent, we helped win two world wars, we helped rebuild the world, we remain one of the world's leading economies, we *are* the world's sole superpower, we put a man on the moon. Several, actually. So yeah, we have a lot to be proud of, and we tend to not let the rest of the world forget it. However, the French didn't mind strutting around when they were on top; the Brits certainly did. The difference there is that the British took the demise of their empire with a shrug and a stiff upper lip; the French sometimes can't seem to get over Waterloo. We're haunted by Vietnam and always will be. I think sometimes the rest of the world doesn't help. One, they keep buying American stuff. You don't like us: quit drinking Starbucks, eating at McDonalds, using an IBM PC, don't fly Boeing (less of a problem these days), and don't watch two-thirds of the movies that come out. Two, when people burn American flags, it makes us think that they're just envious. Not to mention collectively pisses us off. That's my two bucks, anyway.

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American Kafir RE:Not really... 1/17/2004 7:16:23 AM

"when people burn American flags, it makes us think that they're just envious." Especially because in America, it's permissible to burn every other nation's flags including our own.

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fall out RE:Not really... 1/19/2004 12:22:08 AM

well you guys being american and having "freedom for all" should let ppl burn flags and who cares. good point sentinal but... whilst yes your nation was founded on the first functioning republic yet it wasnt really a democratic 1, not untill quite a while later did you have a full democracy. "all men should be treated equal" - all men except every1 bar the rich land owners who got to vote, no women, no black ppl were allowed to vote. im not trying to have a go, just dissecting ur post. g2g now anyway.

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SGTObvious Go with the times, Fallout 1/19/2004 5:00:31 AM

The UNited States is and was a democracy, very advanced by any standard of the times. So was Iceland. The Althing was the world's first parliament- and guess what, Icelandic suffrage AT THE TIME of the Althing was even more restricted than US suffrage in 1800. So? They were both major steps forward. Saying the US government in 1800 was not democratic because not everyone had the vote is like saying the Apollo Landings were not really "space exploration" because we didn't reach other stars. We still don't have a universal vote- children, felons, and the institutionalized insane are excluded. The only difference is that in 1800, the circle of "who is considered competent to vote" was much smaller. Blacks, by the way, could vote where they were free. Women could vote in some states where they were land holders.

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American Kafir RE:Not really... 1/19/2004 10:08:32 AM

>well you guys being american and having "freedom for all" should let ppl burn flags and who cares.< You missed my point. Anybody can burn an American flag. Anywhere. YOU try burning an Iranian flag in the middle of Qom or Tehran.

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evlstu RE:Go with the times, Fallout 1/19/2004 11:32:38 AM

At the time that the US Constitution was ratified in order to vote for national office you had to be a landowner. Being a landowner was seen meaning that you had a vested interest in what happened in your local area. Not being a landowner was seen as not having a vested interest in the local aera. The requirement to own land was always neccessary for state and local elections (usually, but nit always). That was determined by the individual states.

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