Koran reading question

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sofa RE:Koran reading question - directives to followers 7/26/2006 10:45:26 PM

from: link Some things the prophet Mohammed was up to in his lifetime, and which are directions to those who would follow allah: · Marrying his adopted son?s wife after forcing him to divorce her for the prophet?s pleasure. · Marrying a six year old, Aisha a Jewish captive who watched Mohammed?s men kill her family and was forced to sexually to submit to her ?husband? on her ninth birthday. · Raids on peaceful trade caravans and tribal settlements, the use of plunder thus obtained for recruiting an ever growing army of greedy desperados. · Assassinations of opponents. · Blackmail, expulsion and massacre of the Jews of Medina. · Rape of women and children captured in raids or after battles. · Sale of these victims as slaves after rape (if no one bought them they were summarily executed). · Hostage taking for ransom. · Trickery, treachery, bribery and strong-armed bully-boy tactics employed to their fullest extent to grow the numbers of his religion. · Conveniently re-interpreting the ?Word of Allah? every time he broke a previous law he attributed to Allah. ------- "Let the light of the Truth burn the ignorance from your mind!"

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sofa RE:Koran reading question _3 7/26/2006 10:52:17 PM

"I know no sections which encourages barbartism and killing. Can you be more specific? Which sections you are talking about?" -Pars Have you ever read the koran? Are you some farmer from Iowa pretending to be somebody else? ----- the verse of the sword: "Fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem." (Koran 9:5) "Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you." (Koran 9:123) "When you meet the unbelievers in jihad [holy war], chop off their heads. And when you have brought them low, bind your prisoners rigorously. Then set them free or take ransom from them until the war is ended." (Koran, 47:4) "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and his messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be to be killed or crucified, or to have their hands and feet chopped off on opposite sides, or to be expelled out of the land. Such will be their humiliation in the world, and in the next world they will face an awful horror." (Koran, 5:33-34) Corruption in the land, or corruption/mischief on earth, is a huge category of offenses, violent or non-violent, that significantly go against Islam. Google "corruption on earth" + "death penalty" to get an idea of the range of offenses considered to fit that category today in some strict Islamic countries. These crimes vary widely, including, for a few examples, criticizing or calling for changes in Islamic traditions; practicing "sorcery"; engaging in "charlatanism"; sex between a non-Muslim man and a Muslim woman; highway robbery; destruction of buildings; and terrorism against Muslims. "When we decide to destroy a population, we send a definite order to them who have the good things in life and yet sin. So that Allah's word is proven true against them, then we destroy them utterly." (Koran, 17:16-17) "In order that Allah may separate the pure from the impure, put all the impure ones [all non-Muslims] one on top of another in a heap and cast them into hell. They will have been the ones to have lost." (Koran, 8:37) "How many were the populations we utterly destroyed because of their sins, setting up in their place other peoples." (Koran, 21:11) Many more examples and a discussion: link More examples: link ---- Clearly, Islam is an excuse to murder, plunder, rape and abuse others. Pars - Are you trying to deceive kafirs (which is a tactical directive in the Koran/Hadiths)? Or are you that naive about islam, and unable to see the harm it's done for 1400 years?

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sofa RE:unanswered Koran reading question 7/26/2006 10:55:10 PM

Can someone help me find any portions of the Koran which set out any humanism or respect for others? --Still waiting---

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Scratchie RE:unanswered Koran reading question 7/26/2006 10:57:59 PM

if you read the Qu'ran you would see it. Stop provacating.

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sofa RE:unanswered Koran reading question 7/26/2006 11:28:40 PM

Yes, the Koran is provocative and upsetting to read. Many deny the evidence in the koran, the hadiths, and the actions of the death cult in the real world. Can you cite specific portions of the Koran not 'overturned' by later sections, which set out any humanism or respect for others?

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sofa RE:Koran reading question _3_again 7/26/2006 11:56:59 PM

"I know no sections which encourages barbartism and killing. Can you be more specific? Which sections you are talking about?" -Pars ----- More: Allah wants Muslims to kill the infidels (unbelievers) wherever they are found (Koran 9:5), and that peace will come only to those who submit to him (Koran 8:17, 48:29, and 65). The Koran also has Allah saying that unbelievers should be killed (Koran 2:191, 3:141, 4:104, 4:89, 8:12-16, 9:5, 9:73-74, 9:123, 25:52?), that Muslim apostates should be killed or chastised (Koran 2:39, 2:85, 3:85, 3:106, 4:89, 16:106, and 47:25-28), that the heads and fingers of unbelievers should be cut off (Koran 5:33, 8:12, and 47:4), and that Muslims should fight and humiliate Jews and Christians (Koran 5:18 and 9:29). For Allah, warfare is good (Koran 2:216) and jihad (fighting in the way of Allah) should continue until only Islam is dominant (Koran 2:193, 3:85, 8:39, 9:33, 35:37 and 61:9). Allah wants his followers to slaughter his enemies (Koran 8:67), allows Muslims to loot (Koran 8:1, 8:41, 8:69, and 59:7), to commit suicide (Koran 2:154, 2:207, 3:140-144, 3:157, 9:111 and 47:4), and to acquire slaves (Koran 4:3, 4:23-24 and 8:67). Muhammad himself was allowed to engage in unlimited sex with female slaves and captives (Koran 4:3, 23:6, 33:50-52 and 70:30). In addition, Allah orders Muslims not to take Jews, Christians and other unbelievers as friends (Koran 3:28, 5:51 and 9:23), and will not forgive Christians (Koran 4:48 and 4:116). Muhammad taught to put the infidels to death wherever they were found (Koran 2:191, 2:244, 4:89, 5:36, 9:5, and 9:29), urged Muslims to fight the unbelievers who are close (Koran 9:123), mentioned that fighting is obligatory (Koran 2:216), and mandated the conquering of those relatives who opposed Muslims because loyalty to Islam overrode all other human bonds (Koran 9:23-24, and 58:22). Muhammad is also quoted in the Koran as urging fighting until Islam is the only religion (Koran 2:193, 8:39, and 61:9), seeking the death of apostates (Koran 9:73-74), accepting slavery (Koran 4:3, 4:24, 5:87-89, 23:6, 24:32-33, 33:50-52 and 70:30), supporting the slaughter of captives (Koran 8:67), the raping of women captives (Koran 4:24), beheading the infidels (Koran 47:4), and approving looting in wars (Koran 24:29, and 48:20-21). The Koran states that if Muslims do not fight, Allah will replace them with others who will. (Koran 9:39). Those who cannot fight must help fellow Muslims in other ways, including through donations of money. (Koran 8:72). Only Islamic law or sharia is lawful for Muslims (Koran 5:50). There will not be mercy on unbelievers (Koran 5:36-38 and 48:29). The end of the jihad will happen when there is faith only in Allah (Koran 2:193). Power must belong to Muslims only (Koran 63:8), and they must exert power over non-Muslims (Koran 4:141). ---- Pars - You've asked me for specific sections that I have questions about, and I am providing that information. Do you have sections of the Koran which support your position?

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sofa RE:Koran reading question _1 7/27/2006 12:13:09 AM

Sadly, the surah you cite doesn't make islam sound so nice.... Surah 23:6 refers to slave in many translations. Here's some more sex with enslaved women (4.3,4.24, 23.6, 33.50, 70.30) And please continue reading in surah 23 ... [23.32] So We sent among them an apostle from among them, saying: Serve Allah, you have no god other than Him; will you not then guard (against evil)? [23.41] So the punishment overtook them in justice, and We made them as rubbish; so away with the unjust people. [23.42] Then We raised after them other generations. [23.43] No people can hasten on their doom nor can they postpone (it). [23.44] Then We sent Our apostles one after another; whenever there came to a people their apostle, they called him a liar, so We made some of them follow others and We made them stories; so away with a people who do not believe! "[23.48] So they rejected them and became of those who were destroyed." --Oops. Had to destroy more and more unbelievers! Where's the part where islam is offers me a choice other than assimilation into islam, or death?

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sofa RE:Koran and Government 7/27/2006 12:45:03 AM

"Islam do not force anyone to living any sort of government." -Pars What is Sharia law?

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kane RE:sofa 7/27/2006 5:20:15 AM

lol calm down!!! Look Islam is much more diffrent in where i live,there is no Sharia,no religious killings and stuff.Religion do noy rule over my country. Islam is a fast spreading religion.Most of the Muslims are badly educated(just look at middle east)and this is why they got Quran wrong. Anyway,Pars likes researching wait for him. there were some discussions link you can find more in terrorism boards

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sofa RE: kane 7/27/2006 5:23:53 PM

Good points. Some of the problems are a result of being 'badly educated'. But it also seems that islam pushes people into a way of thinking that has effects in the real world (just look at the middle east).

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