Will all French citizens please comment on this?

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swhitebull RE:Will all French citizens please comment on this? 11/24/2003 8:10:28 PM

And more: THe EU refuses to release to study that shows many, of not the majority of antiSemitic incidences are promulgated by Arabs and/or Muslims: The EU's Denial By Bertrand Benoit Financial Times | November 24, 2003 The European Union's racism watchdog has shelved a report on anti-semitism because the study concluded Muslims and pro-Palestinian groups were behind many of the incidents it examined. The Vienna-based European Monitoring Centre on Racism and Xenophobia (EUMC) decided in February not to publish the 112-page study, a copy of which was obtained by the Financial Times, after clashing with its authors over their conclusions. The news comes amid growing fears that there is an upsurge of anti-semitism in European Union countries. Among many recent incidents, a Jewish school near Paris was firebombed last Saturday, the same day two Istanbul synagogues were devastated by suicide truck bombs that killed 25 and wounded 300. Turkey, which hopes to join the EU, suffered again at the hands of what are believed to be al-Qaeda inspired terrorists on Thursday with truck bomb attacks on British targets. Following a spate of incidents in early 2002, the EUMC commissioned a report from the Centre for Research on Anti-semitism at Berlin's Technical University. When the researchers submitted their work in October last year, however, the centre's senior staff and management board objected to their definition of anti-semitism, which included some anti-Israel acts. The focus on Muslim and pro-Palestinian perpetrators, meanwhile, was judged inflammatory. "There is a trend towards Muslim anti-semitism, while on the left there is mobilisation against Israel that is not always free of prejudice," said one person familiar with the report. "Merely saying the perpetrators are French, Belgian or Dutch does no justice to the full picture." Some EUMC board members had also attacked part of the analysis ascribing anti-semitic motives to leftwing and anti-globalisation groups, this person said. "The decision not to publish was a political decision." The board includes 18 members - one for each member state, the European Commission, Parliament, and the council of Europe - as well as 18 deputies. One deputy, who declined to be named, confirmed the directors had seen the study as biased. In July, Robert Wexler, a US congressman, wrote to Javier Solana, the EU's foreign policy chief, demanding the release of the study. Ole Espersen, law professor at Copenhagen University and board member for Denmark, said the study was "unsatisfactory" and that some members had felt anti-Islamic sentiment should be addressed too. The EUMC, which was set in 1998, has published three reports on anti-Islamic attitudes in Europe since the September 11 attacks in the US. Beate Winkler, a director, said the report had been rejected because the initial time scale included in the brief - covering the period between May and June 2002 - was later judged to be unrepresentative. "There was a problem with the definition [of anti-semitism] too. It was too complicated," she said. This week, Silvan Sha lom, Israel's foreign minister, proposed a joint ministerial council to fight what Israel sees as a rise in European anti-semitism swhitebull - makes you wonder what all those immigrants are doing to local politics

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American Kafir RE:Will all French citizens please comment on this? 11/25/2003 4:19:13 PM

The trouble is in the inflection of the phrase. The French posters here insist that France does not have a problem with anti-Semitism. Perhaps we should ask why they don't see anti-Semitism as a problem?

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NewGuy Still waiting for the French response... 11/25/2003 6:35:30 PM

I really am interested in hearing why French posters here think there is no significant problem with anti-semitism in France, given the article mentioned, and numerous other incidents and writings on this subject. Related news -- President Chirac announced plans to create a ministerial committee charged with combatting anti-Semitism (which I applaud -- but this is the very same President that just over a year ago said France had no such problem, so forgive me if I wonder at his motives). Is this not another indication that anti-semitism is a serious problem in France? NewGuy

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Ander320 RE:Still waiting for the French response... 2/17/2004 5:10:32 AM

One french response: The french who said there's no problem with anti-semitism in France may be want to said there's no problem of anti-semitism inside France gouvernement and institution. If they said there is no problem at all they are blind. There is a problem of anti-semitism with (globaly) three groups of people: 1_ French fascist leader are anti semitist. They have strong echo in part of the french population for their anti arabe stance but they slowly try to develop anti semitism in the country. 2_ The far left who oppose isreal policy toward palestinian (FMPOV oppose Israel policy isn't anti-semetism whatever you think about the subject) have some of there leader who aren't clear at all about anti semitism. The roots of this anti semitism should came from the traditionnal communist anti semitism. 3_ Part of the french muslim is anti semist too. About the book (sorry i was unable to open the link so my comment is not documented) according to french law he can be forbidden if it is "incitative to racial hate" (not sure of the translation). The problem is law is one thing a good defender lawyer can always turn. From my opinion: Their is an anti semitist problem in France. France gouvernement had to be stronger on the subject but calling the France situation a "kind of intifada" is way from reality.

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SGTObvious Clearly the French are right. 2/17/2004 6:41:24 AM

There is no problem with anti-semitism in France, just as there is no problem with ant-Americanism in France. There is anti-semitism there, and anti-Americanism, and the French have no problem with that.

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Ander320 RE:Clearly the French are right. 2/17/2004 7:37:27 AM

What do you mean? French are for the majority anti semitist? Wrong. There is anti semistist in France. It's a problem. The gouvernement take toi much time to take action and may e they would have to strenghten it. But french are far away from being anti semist by majority. For the anti americanism: Yes french are for the most part anti american. If you take as anti amer'ican to prefer France to the USA. And by the same criteria i'm sure most of the US are anti french cause i'm sure they prefer US to France. Now, speaking seriously about the "anti american" thingh : They 're is two main "anti american" stream in France. _The first one is the Commies and ultra Lefties. I'm almost sure you have some in the US and can imagine what they're. BTW the most extremics commies should be qualify as "anti France" too 'cause they prefer the "internationale" song to our national "Anthem" and oppose every action of our country for long. _Second stream are the head of Gauliste party (Chirac) which main anti americanism came from the old idea of De Gaulle that France have to be an "Independant power" and who base their opposition to the various case US oppose to France (Suez being the most important). This people are mostly old politics and bourgeoisie and are far away from the main "street french" or even from part of there political party. Young gauliste people ar far to be anti american. So anti americanism and anti semitism are problem in France but you've to know that there's many other problems (poverty, anti french sentiment amoung young french muslim, anti muslim sentiment amoung part of the "old roots french", very heavy taxes rates, growing fascist party..) that are pretty damn important for the "french of the street" too and made the situation a bit more complex that you're assumption "French are anti semist, and anti american as a whole".

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appleciderus Interesting 2/17/2004 7:56:44 AM

The Gaulist party is anti-American, in part, because of Suez? Is this not in contradiction to contemporary Gaulist policy?

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Ander320 RE:Interesting 2/17/2004 11:33:09 AM

Part of the political french class and elite was ver upset by the Suez affair. The gauliste politic under De Gaulle era (60) was drive by this "Suez lesson" : US want us to have no freedom in international politic, they just want us to be a puppet. The whole nuke weaponery and Nato reject of De Gaulle was all about that. Chirac and older Gauliste have keep this "lesson". Now the youngest gaulist aren't anymore in this state of mind.

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sentinel28a RE:Interesting 2/17/2004 2:50:25 PM

The impression that I got from de Gaulle was that he wanted Europe to find its own course, with France at the helm and the Brits on the sidelines. Yet even de Gaulle balked at pulling out the US Army from Europe--he saw it as a valuable counterweight against Russia, and most importantly, Germany. It's good to hear that most people in France just love their country and want what's best for it, and not necessarily at the rest of the world's expense. Ander, you and Jacques have restored my faith in France as an ally, despite the political rhetoric.

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jastayme3 RE:Interesting 5/1/2004 1:45:03 PM

he saw it as a valuable counterweight against Russia, and most importantly, Germany. .............................. Germany? Adenhauers Germany? "Ve have Vays of making you buy Volkswagons"

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jastayme3 RE:Interesting 5/1/2004 1:53:28 PM

You know sense the French are "cheese-eating surrender monkeys" and the Americans are "evil hegemonists out to rule the world" lets have the French surrender to us- than both our supposed desires our satisfied. Seriously a few jokes are all right but this is starting to wear. Both us and the French are a bit proud and are bound to annoy each other. But we do still have to live in the same world. So God bless America and Vive la France.

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