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Subject: gun lauched depth charges
jastayme3    4/27/2005 1:18:11 AM
Are "depth shells" feasible. Could their be a line of depth charges meant to be fired from guns? The charges could be fired as fast as any other type of shell and could get a full pattern from miles away. If an "all guns within range could be delivered" the target can be smothered.
Admittedly the depth charge looks archaic. But it is inexpensive and enough of them can do severe damage to a sub. They could actually be mounted on merchant ships making a convoy a more troublesome target. They are no replacement for torpedos, but the increased range of the "depth shell" model makes them a useful compliment.
 
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EW3    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 5:17:20 AM
There was a system called a Hedgehog which while it didn't get fired from a gun kinda did what you are describing. Fired from amidships to make a fairly wide pattern (100s of yards) and combined with depth charges off the stern rack let you cover a pretty wide swath of ocean. Beyond that we still have ASROC. This is a missile with a torpedo on the front end. Generally you can put the torpedo right on top of a sonar target, the torpedo has a parachute, and soon as it hits the water starts a search pattern. It was/is very effective as it's possible to put it on top of you, so if you are at 500 feet you have very little time to react. Then there is an ASROC with a nuke depth charge. Nuff said.
 
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jastayme3    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 9:41:40 AM
Hedgehog was fired in a manner unique to itself. Asroc is useful but a ship can only have so many aboard at a time. It is a torpedo and like all it's tribe is expensive in money and demanding in room-a primary weapon rather than a secondary. What I was thinking of was a depth charge that can actually be fired out of ordinary guns-as another type of shell, to go with AA and anti-surface. It sounds simple to me-so simple that it is suprising it wasn't thought of. Maybe it just wasn't thought of; some things aren't. However I am a good armchair-strategist, but a poor engineer armchair or otherwise. So their might be some bug i don't no about.
 
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EW3    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 12:31:04 PM
Remember that a naval gun kills through kinetic energy. The current standard 5" gun fires a 70lb shell of which only 15 lbs is explosive. I suspect you could up the explosives a bit, but it's a mighty small charge and it would require a direct hit to even dent a sub. The current torpedoes have a 100+lb explosive warhead in the form of a shaped charge, and in some situations it is considered small even though it is designed to explode on contact with a sub. That is why given a 600lb warhead capability the ASROC doesn't use a 600lb depth charge, but rather a 600lb homing todpedo. (or a 1KT nuclear depth charge, which appears now to be retired)
 
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Iano    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 3:06:51 PM
How about the use of anti-submarine mortars and depth charge throwers? A/S mortars were able to place a spread of several depth charges anywhere in a radius of 1000 yards of a ship, could be mounted on a frigate (the Swedes mount them on 4-500 ton corvettes I believe), and I suspect they are vastly cheaper than torpedoes. You can see one onboard HMS Plymouth at the Birkenhead historic warships.
 
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jastayme3    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 3:08:57 PM
For the matter of that I suppose with the Asroc, a missle-piggyback is so expensive that you might as well make it a torpedo and get what advantage you can. In any case your information is interesting; I have long wondered.
 
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HorribleSailor    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 7:46:55 PM
I rather think ASW mortars were phased out because the surface ship had to be too close for comfort to attack the submarine. Helicopters were seen as, and still are, the way forward in terms of attacking a submarine from a surface ship.
 
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Yimmy    RE:gun lauched depth charges   4/27/2005 7:50:24 PM
I believe ASW mortars to be of greater effectiveness in very shallow water than light weight torpedoes though arn't they?
 
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EW3    RE:gun lauched depth charges - Yimmy   4/27/2005 9:51:58 PM
With modern systems, if you got close enough to use an ASW mortar you'd be in deep kimchee. The sub would have dispatched you already. The price of an ASROC is not that bad really. Less than $1million to destroy a $500+million dollar sub is reasonable. But as indicated an helicopter is the prefered way to get a sub, it can dip it's wick right above the sub, and then drop a torpedo on it, and it is done much further range than an ASROC. The ASROC has the advantage of being able to be fired in sea state 9 when the choppers are grounded, or if a sub appears where the chopper is and you need a quick shoot.
 
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