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Subject: How will US navy protect against hi-speed missiles like Sunburn
reefdiver    2/16/2005 6:23:46 PM
The 3M-82 Moskit "Sunburn" does mach 2.1 and has a complex flight pattern. I assume there are other similar class anti-ship missiles with even faster ones on the way. Can the US Navy really defend against such fast and low flying missiles - and how (other than stay out of range)?
 
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Kozmik Imperial    RE:Darth Squirrel    5/27/2005 5:50:10 PM
china is really pushing to get its naval air fleet up to par, as a matter of fact i think they stress that area more than others. and their inventory of anti ship missiles range from old to new. if they do decide to do a saturation attack i'd agree with the squirrel, any admiral would be a little worried. i read thaty the aegis system performed "Adequetely" against supersonic anti-ship missiles but was not tested against supersonic missiles using evasive patterns imagine 100 of these coming at ya. and now recently china is making a go to aquarie the klub anti-ship system from russia to fit to the 8 kilo subs. i would not wanna be anywhere near the straits with that being a given
 
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EW3    RE:Kozmik    5/27/2005 11:25:19 PM
At this point in time thie ChiComs do not have any Naval Air power to speak of. The did buy a carrier about 6 years IIRC, but it was not ready for service and they have done nothing with it. As to their subs, they are second rate at best. Rarely do they ever get into the Pacific, and when they do, they are usually tracked from the time they get underway. If you look at the charts, the mainland is surrounded by lots of little islands that make great listening posts. Not to mention the fairly frequent appearance of subhunting aircraft.
 
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Kozmik Imperial    RE:Kozmik    5/28/2005 2:38:58 AM
thats the funny thing, i don't understand why they have a naval airforce without an air craft, maybe if they just called it a maritime fleet or something
 
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gf0012-aust    RE:Kozmik    5/28/2005 2:55:40 AM
"thats the funny thing, i don't understand why they have a naval airforce without an air craft, maybe if they just called it a maritime fleet or something" couple of things. - they've been training their rated pilots on a simulated carrier deck for years - it was originally based on HMAS Melbournes parameters. - the carriers that they did buy from the Russians (incl Varyag) were conditional purchases with a non military use caveat. - Varyag was relocated recently for refurb, for the last 12 months it's been apparent that her island has been refurbed with new electronics gear - plus it has been refurbed. bearing all that in mind, they don't have a carrier, but i do recall seeing tailhooked JF-17's. either way, they don't have enough relevant critical assets to support a strike force, and they certainly would need 6-12 months to work up even if they slipped a carrier tomorrow.
 
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Kozmik Imperial    RE:Kozmik    5/28/2005 3:10:17 AM
they also have an unfinished KUZNETSOV sittin around, but why would they even need one in the straits?
 
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gf0012-aust    RE:Kozmik    5/28/2005 9:52:41 PM
"they also have an unfinished KUZNETSOV sittin around, but why would they even need one in the straits?" if they continue to expound the "pearls" philosophy, then they will need carriers. China's contested claims in Sth EAst Asia are extensive. Sooner or later, neighbours will start disagreeing with her claims. This is separate to any phoney war with the US. China has been setting up facilities in Gwalor in Pakistan, Myanmar (thus flanking India and covering the oil routes from the middle east via Suez. She has also made noises about setting up a facility in a contested Indonesia Island near the Straits - to counter Indias facilities in the Andomans and to be closer to Diego Garcia - a UK possession but leased by the US. She was caught sniffing around Guam and the Andoman Nicobars Naval facilities at the time of the Tsunami. All of the above points to a more enthusiastic PLAN stretching wings and capability. Strike Fleets as a form of Gunboat Diplomacy will make the Spratlys contest a foregine conclusion assuming that the US doesn't back up the smaller contestants. Even then that is unlikely as there are 7 claimants. The whole thing is a cluster waiting to happen.
 
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Desertmole    RE:Kozmik    5/31/2005 7:32:30 AM
"Strike Fleets as a form of Gunboat Diplomacy will make the Spratlys contest a foregine conclusion assuming that the US doesn't back up the smaller contestants. Even then that is unlikely as there are 7 claimants. The whole thing is a cluster waiting to happen." Too true, though the US might try to apply force in the area to stabilize the situation. I am not sure the US would care to have PLAN bases athwart any key sea lanes. Conceivably, they could get involved supporting, say, the Phillipines if the Chinese decided to get ugly in the Spratleys. There was an interesting book written a number of years ago entitled "Dragon Strike" about just such a conflict.
 
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Desertmole    RE:Kozmik    5/31/2005 7:33:46 AM
"Strike Fleets as a form of Gunboat Diplomacy will make the Spratlys contest a foregine conclusion assuming that the US doesn't back up the smaller contestants. Even then that is unlikely as there are 7 claimants. The whole thing is a cluster waiting to happen." Too true, though the US might try to apply force in the area to stabilize the situation. I am not sure the US would care to have PLAN bases athwart any key sea lanes. Conceivably, they could get involved supporting, say, the Phillipines if the Chinese decided to get ugly in the Spratleys. There was an interesting book written a number of years ago entitled "Dragon Strike" about just such a conflict.
 
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EW3    RE: Desertmole /GF   5/31/2005 7:56:38 AM
Just how important are the Spratlys to any of the potential contestants? Is it important enough for the Phillipines to welcome back a US military presence, like Subic or Clark?
 
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gf0012-aust    RE: Desertmole /GF   5/31/2005 8:50:38 AM
"Is it important enough for the Phillipines to welcome back a US military presence, like Subic or Clark?" IMO, it makes an interesting offer for them.. but then the US would then have the other moderates to placate.
 
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