Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Surface Forces Discussion Board
   Return to Topic Page
Subject: The China Syndrome & the British Navy
human7    7/10/2004 10:00:29 AM
If China launches an invasion of Taiwan, the United States would most certainly react. (This whole notion of ambiguity is American PR.) The question is would the United Kingdom would the stand idly by or would they help to repel the Chinks?
 
Quote    Reply

Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest
Pages: PREV  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16   NEXT
The Lizard King    Sticks for the Chinese / Carrots for the Brits   4/6/2005 4:10:23 PM
Would the Brits get involved if they could get Hong Kong (and perhaps other territory) back permanently?
 
Quote    Reply

ShallowThinker1    RE:The China Syndrome & the British Navy   4/6/2005 5:05:50 PM
What interests does the UK have with the PRC and Taiwan? There is, of course, the matter of helping a fledgling democracy ward off conquest by a dictatorship. That is generally not, however, a sufficient reason for nations to send their military forces off to kill and die. If the UK's interests, geo-strategic, political, and economic, are not significantly harmed by a PRC takeover of Taiwan, the UK is unlikely to help Taiwan. Is the point of the original question from "human7" to try and discover or analyse the national interests of the UK or was it just a vehicle to carry a racist epithet?
 
Quote    Reply

Gothic Irishmen    question..   4/6/2005 5:25:35 PM
ok so if a war goes on will china have the last laugh? before she goes down what if some nuclear weapons hit the continental us? I think every1 forgets she has nuclear weapons before congess declares war will they think about how hollywood would look the next day? if the beaches of san diego still about to used? if the golden gate bridge still there? is congress gonna look at what real trouble we can run into with wmds...
 
Quote    Reply

EW3    RE:question..   4/6/2005 10:07:38 PM
There is no way of knowing how effective the BMD system would be, but there are quite a few SM-3s out there now, and there are land launched ABMs as well. The SM-3s seem to work pretty well, lately I wonder about the landbased versions. But if so much as 1 ChiCom nuke hits the US, they won't know what landed on them. One SBM on patrol could reduce their population problems quite a bit in 30 minutes or less. We have several always in position ready to launch, not to mention missiles from CONUS.
 
Quote    Reply

warishumannature    China will not use nukes first, though WE (US) might or might not   4/7/2005 6:03:24 AM
Chinese strategic nuclear forces are not sufficiently large for first strikes. They would be used only as “revenge” weapons in case they are nuked first. That’s their doctine and frankly, doctrine or no, it makes perfect sense. OTOH, the US may feel it can neutralize the 30 or so ICBMs (presently available) which China has which are capable of striking pretty much anywhere in the CONUS. We might feel we’ll go for it. Note that the price of failure would be catastrophic for everyone. Note that the Chinese ICBMs have anywhere from 30-90+ multi-megaton warheads on them, all basically aimed at American cities. It’s their revenge card: “you nuked us, so we nuked you back – we all lose.” If even a few of these warheads got through, say goodbye to several US metropolitan cities, not only on the west coast, either. IMHO, it would be scant comfort that we wiped out the urban population of China, if we were to lose large parts of our own, especially if we, not they, triggered the nuke exchange. So nukes are probably out for both sides. China’s leaders are supposedly ruthless and calculating, not in any way crazy or suicidal. These are not a bunch of Osamas, after all.
 
Quote    Reply

The Lizard King    RE:The China Syndrome & the British Navy - Not so Shallow Thinker   4/7/2005 8:54:33 AM
Neither know nor care what the original intent of this thread is. "What interests does the UK have with the PRC and Taiwan?" Relevancy & Treasure. Britain has had interest, influence, and presence in the region for the last two hundred years. Could one not make the case that, presently, the Asia/Pacific Rim has never been more strategic? If in agreement with this assertion, could one also conclude that Hong Kong would be far more valuable to the Brits today, than yesterday?
 
Quote    Reply

919    RE:The China Syndrome & the British Navy - Not so Shallow Thinker   4/7/2005 11:32:43 AM
This is all nonsense. The Chinese might be able to put 1 or 2 airborne divisions on TiaWan, but they cannot support them. I would bet that most of the Chinese paras would surrender. Why not? It beats dying, they know the language, or at least their dialect is close enough so they would soon learn it. Lots of babes. China had a shortage of females, Tiawan doesn't. The PRC is mostly a paper tiger. AFAIK and going by the FAS figures on Chinese Ballistic misiles, China has 1 (DF-5/CSS4) type that has the range(13,000 km's) to reach America and that has been tested 3 times, and failed twice. So the Chinese threat to use ICBM's against America is just a threat. Plus because of the American system, we are not going to be destroyed by a small nuclear strike. We have a coup in America ever 4 years, so changing governments is not a big deal. Nuke D.C. and we will just hold another election and start over. On the other hand, taking out the Chinese government would lead to a collapse of China into warlordism. The Chinese understand America much better then most 'furreners' do, so there is no chance of China starting a war over Tiawan. PRC will huff and bluff, but as long as the ROC ignores them, nothing will happen. ThePRC will fall thru an internal revolution (2010) before they invade the ROC.
 
Quote    Reply

ShallowThinker1    RE:The China Syndrome & the British Navy - Not so Shallow Thinker   4/7/2005 12:05:27 PM
Lizard King, "What interests does the UK have with the PRC and Taiwan?" Relevancy & Treasure. Britain has had interest, influence, and presence in the region for the last two hundred years. Perhaps even longer. But how are these interests best served? Would it be in the UK's best interests to fight against the PRC for the sake of Taiwan or to sit back and, presumably, let the US "go it alone"? What does the UK "lose", or "gain" if the PRC "wins" or "loses" in an attempt to take over Taiwan? I don't know the answers to these questions. You might. Is the UK's "Relevancy and Treasure" more interested in PRC or in Taiwan? Could one not make the case that, presently, the Asia/Pacific Rim has never been more strategic? I certainly believe the Pacrim and Asia as a whole, have never been more strategically important to, at the very least, the US than ever. I'm sure the folks living in Asia believe their strategic importance has always been enormous ;) If in agreement with this assertion, could one also conclude that Hong Kong would be far more valuable to the Brits today, than yesterday? Are you saying that HK is more "valuable" to the UK today, in it's current status as part of the PRC than it was as a UK colonial holding? Or are you suggesting that the "recovery" of HK would be something the UK would hope to achieve by joining the US in a successful conflict with the PRC over, for example, the defense of Taiwan?
 
Quote    Reply

ShallowThinker1    RE:The China Syndrome & the British Navy - Not so Shallow Thinker   4/7/2005 12:27:43 PM
Lizard King, My "What interests..." question was a response to the pissing contest that the thread seemed to have sunk into. I know nothing about what interests the UK has in either the PRC or Taiwan but any question about whether or not the UK would militarily aid in the defense of Taiwan against the PRC must, it seems to me, take the UK's "interests" into account. The cost/benefit and/or loss/gain ratios always has to be considered. I don't suggest for even a moment that the UK would not weigh "altruism" into such calculations but I seriously doubt that the UK would be driven purely by "it's the right thing to do therefore we'll do it". You raised the matter of HK. That, to me, is pretty interesting. HK represented some "value" to the UK which, I presume, the UK was able to quantify to some degree. Since the UK didn't "keep" HK I have to assume that either they judged they were incapable of doing so or that the cost/benefit ratio was "better" in allowing it to revert to PRC control. Anyway, those are the kinds of things I prefer to ponder to try and get some better understanding of the issues surrounding trying to answer questions like the one that started this thread. The Big Swinging Dick catfights are not particularly useful to me as I try to learn something. The answer may be as simple as, "The UK cannot add anything that would materially help the US in this and, therefore, they won't help the US." That seems an unlikely answer to me. A carrier task force, or whatever the British equivalent of that is, would surely be powerful enough to materially assist the US. The UK may perceive Taiwan as insufficiently valuable to their interests and, therefore, decline to join in its defense. They may consider their relationship to the US sufficiently valuable to join in the defense of Taiwan. I surely don't know but there are enough British subjects and members of the Commonwealth participating here that I suspect there is some information about that available for the purposes of the discussion. Thanks, BTW, for pointing out the HK card. I'm embarrassed to admit it hadn't crossed my mind.
 
Quote    Reply

AlbanyRifles    2 War Scenario   4/7/2005 1:10:21 PM
We no longer follow the 2 war strategy.....we used to have the force structure but we don't have it anymore.
 
Quote    Reply
PREV  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16   NEXT



 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics