Those Kilos and Songs aren't going to sink by themselves. We need to give them some encouragement.

Herald.

Here, Here.

 

Will there be a Unoccupied/Unman Underwater Vehicle?  A big torpedo that gets close to fire spreads of small torpedoes and then comes back to rearm and recharge?  A some point the sonar gets too expensive to be disposable.  Maybe they just forgot to put it in the press release.

Anyone else worried about This:

Most of
the firepower, however, comes in four metal canisters filled with a new U.S.
Army missile system called  NetFires (or
NLOS-LS). This is still in development.

 Sorry for the multi-enhance, but I always get worried when some new weapon system that is supposed to be placed on a combatent is "still in development".
  What happens if it goes the way of so many other programs and gets cut?  It their a "plan B" somewhere?

This is a radical departure on the traditional frigate, that started out as an over glorified mine warfare ship with some gee whiz add ons.

Herald.

Worried Herald? You are usually very specific in your post. What in particular worries you and why?

-DA

This is a radical departure on the traditional frigate, that started out as an over glorified mine warfare ship with some gee whiz add ons.

Herald.

 Which is my problem-- because the litorral role doesn't need all these Gee whiz add ons. They're nice to have, but they aren't needed and evidence indicates they're insuring tha tthe one thing we do need (if we're going with a traditional style of littoral ship), I.E. lots of platforms, is the one thing we're not going to have. 
  The fact of the matter is that the weapons mentioned so far could be carried by smaller vessels-- and the UAV and other "gee whiz" parts, could be carried by mother ships or not carried at all, because as nice as they are, they're not needed. (and I must admit, if we're worried about China (which we should be regardless if we think we'll ever go to war, because they are the most likely competiator), I'm worried about putting too much into UAV's and UCAVs, etc, because the Chinese are not stupid, they're not Hussien's Iraq army, and it'd be very embaressing to find out that our data links aren't as ECM invulnerable as we thought).
  Fundamentaly, we're getting a fast, but over gadgeted, under armed, and very, very expensive boat. Doesn't seem like a very good buy right now.

An "inexpensive ship" is the antithesis of a "good ship."  Inexpensive means that we've deliberately used inferior materials (aluminum v. steel), tried to make it into a Swiss Army Knife (organic capability v. "plug & pray" modules), made it too small to be survivable, and invested heavily in promises and vaporware.  Then we set the manning requirements based on "want" instead of "need."

 

Sheffield, Ardent, Antelope, and Stark seem forgotten at SUPSHIPS.  Aluminum is best used for foil in the galley not for the ribs and skin of a warship.  Moreover, the "minimal manning" disease has stripped manpower to a dangerously low level and is replaced by the fool's faith in computers, machines, and gadgets.  In combat, things break, fires burn, and Sailors get killed.  History guarantees that following Hit Alpha, the computers will not work, the remote equipment will no work, there will be no or limited electrical power, and anything of importance will be on fire. 

 

When, not if, that happens these ships will not have the defensive capability to fend off the attack, will be gravely damaged because they are too small to absorb the damage, will not have the redundancy of systems to continue steaming, will not have the crew size to absorb casualties and continue to fight the ship, and will not have the crew size to man large damage control parties. 

 

Frankly, I'd be much more bully about LCS if they'd have simply come out and said:  "These ships are not meant to survive."    You then know that its a bit of a suicide mission when the shooting starts, and that, paradoxically, somehow makes it OK. 

 

Or, as my first Chief used to put it:  "Don't urinate on my head and tell me its raining."

 

Cheers,

Chief B.

I have also often wondered what the purpose was of trying to compete in the Littorals.  If your an occupier, sure it makes sense as part of local enforcement or against guerillas using said waterways as supply or for strikes against your forces.  For grand naval strategy, whats the point?  The Blue-Water is whats important.  Its not like your weapons magically cease working when the water they fly over gets shallow...

Herald,

What do you think Mahan would think of the LCS?

He'd wonder why we over-designed it.

If I know his theories correctly we should not even be going to fight in Litorrals since we own the Deep Blue we still control the commerce. We gain little by trying to own the thin brown layer.

He'd say, that the littorals are a battle-space you'd manage with helos and remotely operated vehicles.that you send as intrusion events to kill enemy small fry.  If you have to fight inshore you build manned and robot patrol boat expendables and expect to take many casualties in machines and small gunboats [CREF riverine warfare.]

With LCS we are making compromises to get there because no one would risk a AEGIS ship in the littoral.

We do risk Aegis ships in the littorals. Where are the frigates ?

Which is the problem-- we already have a hugely expensive ship that doesn't even come with all the kit it needs-- for that we have to pay more. 
  Remember, the LCS was supposed to be the cheap ship that allowed us to have the numbers that would let us buy a smaller number of superships.  We're not getting that.  We're getting what is looking increasingly like another A-12 fiasco with the minor bright spot that we at least have a couple of hulls.
  But a "couple" of hulls won't cut it. We need LOTS of hulls for this ship class to be useful and they have to be hulls that can do the job, not ones tied up at port because nobody can afford the modules.
  Someone really, really needs to let the Navy know that "Cutting Edge" and "Cheap and fast" aren't the same thing. If you try to put high speed engines, advanced modules, etc, etc, on a ship you will get an expensive ship.  As it is, I'll lay good odds that four or five years from now, the LCS project will be dead in the water, and we won't have ANY ship.

If you have to fight inshore you build manned and robot patrol boat expendables and expect to take many casualties in machines and small gunboats [CREF riverine warfare.]

Herald