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Subject: Libyan No Fly Zone
giblets 3/17/2011 6:03:02 PM

Seeing as there does not appear to be a Libyan discussion area (an omission surely?). Thought it would be worth discussing. With the UN currently voting on a no fly zone, and talk of this being led by the EU and contribution by up to 5 arab nations. Who would contribute what? Am sure the RAF could contribute Tornados for the early stage of the process (the SEAD phase), but would like to see the Typhoons involved later. As for teh French, likely to include Rafales? And Arab countries, Saudi with their F-15's or Typhoons (if they are trained up). The UAE could use their block 60's? And surely Egypt would be involved on this one.

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gf0012-aust 3/17/2011 6:46:48 PM

UN clears way for Libya no-fly zone

http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/201103/r736188_5978536.jpg" width="285" />

Rebels prepare for Moamar Gaddafi's promised storming of Benghazi. (AFP: Patrick Baz)

The United Nations Security Council has voted to adopt a resolution that allows for a no-fly zone and other measures to protect civilians in Libya.

The vote comes as Moamar Gaddafi told Libyan rebels that his armed forces were coming to their capital Benghazi tonight and would not show any mercy to fighters who resisted them.

French diplomatic sources suggest targeted air raids could start immediately.

Mr Gaddafi's latest threats have raised the sense that a decisive moment has come in a month-old uprising inspired by rebellions against autocratic rule elsewhere in the Arab world.

The security council resolution, backed by Arab powers and submitted by France, Britain and Lebanon, could open the way for air strikes to protect civilians from retribution by the man who has ruled Libya for 41 years.

It authorises a no-fly zone and "all necessary measures" to protect civilians under threat.

In a sharp shift in tone, the United States said it was actively pushing for measures "short of boots on the ground" and the possible bombing of government targets.

More soon.

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giblets 3/17/2011 7:05:29 PM

The French were pretty confident of getting permission, sending Alain Juppe over, they also said that they could get aircraft into action within hours, one wonders if the aircraft were in the air, or bombed up already.

Good to see Obama finally coming onside, though sadly the Germans let the European side down by abstaining.

According to AP:

One official said Jordan, Qatar and the United Arab Emirates were among possible participants, in a showing designed to demonstrate that the effort to aid anti-Gadhafi rebels had support from other countries in the region.

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VelocityVector giblets 3/17/2011 8:02:27 PM

With deposement what is to be obtained? Quite possibly Islamic sharia rule. So perhaps weaken The Colonel but if France should eliminate this regime then France had best have a favorable succession plan that it knows will hold. Good luck, France, it is your backyard and you will live with the consequences just as we in the U.S. are doing. 0.02

v^2

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Reactive 3/17/2011 9:46:37 PM

With deposement what is to be obtained? 1) Quite possibly Islamic sharia rule2). So perhaps weaken The Colonel but if France should eliminate this regime then France had best have a favorable succession plan that it knows will hold. Good luck, France, it is your backyard3) and you will live with the consequences just as we in the U.S. are doing.4) 0.02

v^2

1) We (hopefully get rid of Gaddafi) which means we get rid of a major sponsor of terrorism who has just been given a major reason to hate the west, we also get to influence succession to some degree and most importantly, we avoid a situation where vast oil reserves are used against the west. (this assumes that Gaddafi falls)

2) I doubt it, the disbanded army units are a good starting point - and with respect to the "rebels" they've not been nearly as islamo-whacko as has been feared - the remarkable thing is that the "libyan" identity has come before anything else - yes it is a deeply religious nation but Benghazi has not felt like a city run by the Taliban.

3) Not just France's backyard, it's everyone who has a reliance on oil's backyard, that includes the EU and US to an equal degree, Gaddafi made promises to the west that he is sure to break now that every nation came out publicly against him - what happens if he starts to develop a WMD program or finance terrorist groups throughout north africa, he has the resources if left unchecked (and unbalanced as he is) to create a huge amount of problems for the region.

4) If what I suspect is correct then Obama has played a game of absolute genius - by appearing to be reluctant, yet at the last moment proposing a far more sweeping intervention than France was proposing, at the critical time - if it was intentional and it works out then he will certainly go up in my estimation. - Everyone in the MSM is making the US administration appear reluctant - the same end game happens but the blame falls elsewhere...

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Phaid 3/17/2011 9:50:24 PM

Bobo didn't do jack, this was all Hillary's doing.

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Reactive 3/17/2011 9:53:33 PM

Looking at the press: EVERYONE is buying the line that the US is an reluctant sponsor of freedom in Libya - just for a moment try to think about it in terms of national posture - the US won't be seen as the aggressors - even people posting here are saying that this is a reluctant, late acceptance of the UNSC resolution - in which case why did the ammendment to "defend civilans by any means necessary" come out of the blue at the last moment from the US itself...

Think outside the box here.

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Reactive 3/17/2011 9:55:02 PM

Ok, maybe not Obama, but someone has done something brilliant, if it was Hilldog then she must have pitched it to B.O in terms that made sense - whoever came up with the strategy deserves serious respect.

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VelocityVector 3/18/2011 12:33:32 AM

Hopefully, all surviving KBR and Bechtel dudes will share their newfound wealth back in the States if and when they manage to smother the burning petrol fires in the mustard gas and radiologically-contaminated environment which may come soon from a dying regime. A fine thing EU weather is warming, too. Give 'em the steel, boys. (popcorn)

v^2

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RedParadize 3/18/2011 12:57:20 AM

Reactive 3/17/2011 9:46:37 PM

I am sure you are all aware that he did both terrorism, finance terrorism and WMD. He had a 'quite advanced' nuclear program before 2003. Everyone was suprise that he had modern the Gas centrifuge (D2 or something like that). But in 2003 he was in deep need of cash cause of the embargo. So he droped the nuclear program, the financement of the palestinian terrorism group and cooperated with the CIA on the war on terror. Yeah, he had problem with al qaeda too back then.

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giblets 3/18/2011 5:12:11 AM

Think a lot of countries come out of this well, the US obviously can take the back seat for once, and is not seen as the agressor, whilst the UK and France can be seen to be taking the lead. The Lebanon also gets great kudos for leading the Arab world in this.
Russian and China, for not using their veto, and allowing a lot more than just the no fly zone.

The only country to come out badly? Germany.

Just waiting for the jets to get in the air now.

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