more to the point, is that some of the other countries in the consortium (like the UK) have veto rights on distributing tech as they are the only Tier 1 partner.

Nobody else can get into the schedule unless we break ranks and volunteer to give up our own delivery slots.  Anyone outside the 8 cannot just walk in and ask for access to the platform specs because a number of developments are not US IP.  In fact a few xcountries are never going to get into the queue because they aren't cleared for it/trusted due to specific ITARs issues.

sigh.

I should apologise to truck drivers, as my intent was not to denigrate them.  take aways drivers and loggies and militaries go nowhere.

This sort of thing is endemic to open forums. It's really not that hard to start one of your own, you should go try it.

I post poor posts myself sometimes, but I am aware of it, furthermore I do know some subjects properly, and this IS an open forum.

I suppose my line goes further down the road for clinical reasons as well as knowing less about these technical subjects and for my own philosophical reasons.

 

As long as its an open forum people should be able to post what may or may not be hogwash, but should analyse and consider the opinions of others after a while of fun and games/messing around.

 

----------

 

 

As to 10 million dollars, that seems like about the right price to me. I wonder how detailed the report will be tho.

Hmmm, I suppose fun and games and messing around I have done at times with radical arguments for the sake of it. :)

 

Can't really say I joust except when I'm exposed to the idiot and co., which unfortunately is in a field I know next to nothing about.

 

I guess I should be glad they don't fight about the war in Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan, but it wouldn't have made me look bad in the Rafale threads. Idiots in denial don't need bashing from newbies with a temper. Oh well.

 

 

At any rate, closed forums have quite a different athmosphere. What detracts from it is the lack of people unless one is actively inviting.

 

 

Btw.: a very old comment I made about Australians and then I said something bad (don't remember what), it's been a bit justified. Australians apparently have the highest self-image of thirty polled nations... kind of explains the foreign policy hypocrisy.

 

 

But uh yeah, I'm just making my peace (that's why I'm derailing adhd style) before leaving this site with its often good but sometimes mediocre and poor articles and occasionally great commentaries. I need more time elsewhere.

 

 

 

PS. I totally agree with not selling Japan the F-22 when they're being jerks like now. If they're throwing a fuss over 10 million dollars, that just makes them look bad, trying to score PR on that is low.

Not that I'm feeling bad towards you or anyone else complaining about them on this thread. I was just opening most commented to make comments to give a fair representation before leaving.

 

 

I'm sure most people will be relieved, as this forum does not have the edit function for me to make proper posts.

... A fair represenation of opinions that is...

 

Which to get back on track (sorry, even if it is hard for me, 'meh' to anyone who's angry though), Slowman, they aren't pushing Japan into the EF's arms. Those two planes can't compare in stealth, and if production goes as plannes the 35 will be cheaper. I dunno about strike capabilities, except they both are, but the 35 should be better in that as well.

 

It seems from the OP you made that you think 1 billion yen is some sort of exortion. Western governments do that very rarely. It usually pays to research why something 'weird' happened rather than make assumptions.

@ FVJ



> The want the F22 to use as shortcut in getting research and know-how for building up their own jet fighter industry.



If F-22 was exported to Japan, Japanese would have been barred from its maintenance; all they could do with it was to arm, fuel up, and fill the ammo. The actual maintenance, including stealth coating, would have been done at US-run facilities. And this was acceptable to Japan, since with F-22, Japanese air dominance over Chinese and Koreans is now guaranteed(Until Koreans get their F-22s, then you have a nice F-22 vs F-22 dogfight during the Grand Naval Showdown).



@ StevoJH



> Think about it this way, consider how much money the countries and companies that developed these capabilities spent, $10Million for data that may either help them with their own research



That $10 million marketing brochure(That's what it is being called over there by angry Japanese folks) doesn't contain any of that; it simply contains some numbers and combat simulation cases, so that Japanese DoD could run a comparison of F-35 against Typhoon and F-15SE. If that was possible, then Japanese would be reverse-engineering Typhoons and F-15SE already since BAE and Boeing already provided everything Japanese asked for.

 

> or make them buy a few of the aircraft so they can try break into the systems?



Foreign F-35 operators are barred from opening up F-35, it must be opened up at designated US-run regional maintenance facilities.



@ Slim Pickinz



> The Japanese F-X program is open, yes we get that. But the JSF Consortium in NOT OPEN.



Then don't bother show up in open competitions, which is like every foreign F-X program.



@ gf0012-aust



> more to the point, is that some of the other countries in the consortium (like the UK) have veto rights on distributing tech as they are the only Tier 1 partner.



So that UK could sell Typhoon to Japan, I see.

If you go back and read your own thread moron, the US is not pushing the F-35 into the F-X competition, it's the Japanese who are asking for information for their own considerations.

 

And for the hundredth time, there is not going to be a war between Korea and Japan. Put it to rest! And since the F-22 production line is now CLOSED, Korea will not be getting any F-22s at any point in time in the future, no matter how much you drool over the prospect.

@ Slim Pickinz



> the US is not pushing the F-35 into the F-X competition



It is.



> it's the Japanese who are asking for information for their own considerations.



They ask for information on all candiates; F-15FX(SE info was added), Super Hornet, Typhoon, and F-35. Only the US government pushing F-35 is demanding a payment for providing info.

 

> And for the hundredth time, there is not going to be a war between Korea and Japan.



Japanese and Korean defense department and rightwingers strongly disagree. They have a score to settle, preferably sooner than later.

Provide a reputable link to prove so.