Rafale F3 leading Brazilian F-X race on the promise of extensive tech transfer over Super Hornet

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SlowMan 8/7/2009 4:31:25 PM

< link >

Ha Ha Ha, the US jacked up the price like crazy.

For $7 billion,

- 28 F/A-18Es
- 8 F/A-18Fs
- spares for above
- 36 AN/APG-79 Radar Systems
- 36 M61A2 20mm Gun Systems
- 36 AN/ALR-67(V) three Radar Warning Receivers
- 144 LAU-127 Launchers
- 44 Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing Systems
- 28 AIM-120C-7 Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missiles
- 28 AIM-9M Sidewinder Missiles
- 60 GBU-31/32 Joint Direct Attack Munitions
- 36 AGM-154 Joint Standoff Weapons
- 10 AGM-88B HARM Missiles
- 36 AN/ASQ-228 (V2) Advanced Targeting Forward-Looking Infrared Pods
- 36 AN/ALQ-214 Radio Frequency Countermeasures
- 40 AN/ALE-47 Electronic Warfare Countermeasures Systems

- 112 AN/ALE-50 Towed Decoys

Not indicated in above article, but Brazilian sources say

- $3 billion worth of Super Hornet tech.

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SlowMan 8/7/2009 4:45:45 PM

@ doggtag

> Some people just don't want to let the F-23 die, do they?

The person who drew that must have been a fan of YF-23. I actually got that picture from one of older Super Hornet Block 3 post here.

> But seriously: a plus side to this could be, Boeing could then propose a stretched model to fulfill the extended range tactical bomber role

The plus side to Boeing is that they would now get a competitive platform to compete for both US Navy and international sales against single-engined F-35, with features not available for it, such as supercruise. Without a new platform(which only Korean government is willing to fund its development at the moment), Boeing goes out of fighter business.

> I for one would bet the Israelis would pounce on such a platform in a heartbeat.

Of course.

> Ditto for a number of US allies who like the idea of long range strike capabilities (UK, Australia,.. Taiwan even?)

UK : Broke and can't afford.
Australia : Happy with F-35??? Already bought Super Hornet.
Taiwan : Boeing would not dare to sell any weapon to Taiwan and risk its commercial jet business in China.

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Rufus 8/7/2009 5:11:31 PM

"The plus side to Boeing is that they would now get a competitive platform to compete for both US Navy and international sales against single-engined F-35, with features not available for it, such as supercruise. Without a new platform(which only Korean government is willing to fund its development at the moment), Boeing goes out of fighter business."

See... this is the thing you just don't seem to be getting.

Developing a new fighter is one of those things that is so absurdly expensive that even a relatively large country(like France), with the experience and technology in house, finds it an extremely challenging and risky venture.

The US doesn't have their fighters funded by mid-sized players so that the US Navy can later buy them down the road.

You have the whole process backwards.

IF the US decides to build such a fighter at some point in the future, perhaps Korea will buy it. As for Boeing, they are doing just fine for business. They are going to pick up some additional orders over the next few years and are hardly desperate. We aren't talking about Dassault, Saab, Sukhoi or Mig here...

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SlowMan 8/7/2009 7:37:09 PM

@ Rufus

> The US doesn't have their fighters funded by mid-sized players so that the US Navy can later buy them down the road. You have the whole process backwards.

KC-45 : Airbus A330 MRTT adopted by USAF
VH-71 Kestrel(aka Marine One) : US adoptation of AgustaWestland AW101
AV-8B : USMC adoptation of Harrier

There are sewveral examples where the US military adopted an aircraft developed by a foreign country. With F-22 dead and sole-surviving F-35 being single-engined, the US Navy does have to consider adopting a twin-engine plane developed with foreign government's funding if they wish to have a twin engine aircraft.

With the US Navy's historical preference for twin-engined jet, are they really ready to go all F-35?

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Rufus 8/8/2009 2:48:20 AM

Yes the US uses some foreign technology, almost always European...

The fact that you would even bring up such a stupid list of examples shows that you are utterly clueless. None of those are products produced by mid-level players, like Korea, and two of the three are canceled commercial conversions.

The Harrier is the only jet you could make even a weak argument for, and that is older than dirt and was originally a UK project. (Not a mid-level player)

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maruben Canceled 8/9/2009 1:55:50 AM

VH-71 Kestrel(aka Marine One) : US adoptation of AgustaWestland AW101

And also this adoption was canceled.

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SlowMan 9/3/2009 10:18:11 AM

< link >

Brazil's president has given his endorsement of Rafale bid.

The formal announcement of Rafale selection is expected to be announced during Sarkozy's visit to Brazil.

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Phaid 9/3/2009 2:37:17 PM

The formal announcement of Rafale selection is expected to be announced during Sarkozy's visit to Brazil.

I see we're making up news again.

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stbretnco 9/3/2009 11:41:12 PM

<link... >

Brazil's president has given his endorsement of Rafale bid.

The formal announcement of Rafale selection is expected to be announced during Sarkozy's visit to Brazil.

Maybe I have a comprehension problem, but I fail to see how this quot from the linked article:

Lula would not say which aircraft he prefers but said he may talk Thursday with France's President Nicolas Sarkozy after meeting with Brazil's defense minister and the commander of the air force.

Translates into

Brazil's president has given his endorsement of Rafale bid.

The formal announcement of Rafale selection is expected to be announced during Sarkozy's visit to Brazil.

Is it just me? LOL

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sentinel28a 9/4/2009 12:16:34 AM

Dassault does have a pretty good track record with Brazil, plus I imagine the Brazilians are looking at a replacement for the A-4KUs they have at some point for the Sao Paulo. The Rafale would fit both requirements, though so would the Super Hornet. I agree that I won't believe it until I see the ink dry on a contract, but I would say it is a good possibility, given Brazil's previous French buys.

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