It's actually not that cryptic.

 

 

The bomb fuse failed to function as designed because it was in the WRONG location. The US fuses are NOW located in the midbody on the casing strong-back. THAT is why I knew that BA was wrong on that contract as of this year, Warpig. The German fuses (not French) won't fit.

Herald

What has that got to do with p.15 of the briefing, or even the overall question of what fuses the French use in their bombs?  Honestly, Herald, sometimes I just can not follow your train of thought.

 

Furthermore, I would bet that the couple other people who sort of chimed in absolutely could not have guessed that this observation regarding some recent test results was what you were referring to in your previous posts.

 

1. You would be wrong.

2. The bomb fuse location and architecture..

Pages 31-38 inclusive. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1.  You would be wrong.

2.  Thank you for another interesting briefing.  Which, by the way, had nothing to do with the French fuses under discussion nor in any way refuted what BA said.  If it did, TELL HOW IT DID.  Otherwise, that was just another crytic post.

 

The bombs under discussion, WP, are US made not French. The initiators are midbody sited and part of the fuses. The Thales fuses are incompatible with the initiators. What is so hard to understand?  

 

Herald

 

The bombs under discussion, WP, are US made not French. The initiators are midbody sited and part of the fuses. The Thales fuses are incompatible with the initiators. What is so hard to understand?  

Since when does the initiator have anything to do with anything BA was saying, furthermore, where in anything you've already posted did you even mention anything about the initiator such that something about them ought to have been understood, who/what says the French fuse is incompatable with the US initiator, and why should we care since the French briefing also shows initiators (presumably also French) to go along with the French fuses?  So what if the Mk82 (for example) are US made?  The French fuse is essentially an equivalent for the FMU-143 and can be used in the same standard 3inch fuse well as the US fuses that are also designed for use in the Mk82.  Page 15 of that French briefing shows an initiator in the circuit right there at the standard mid-body site, don't you think it's likely to be compatable with the French fise?

 

What the heck was your original point back around page 42 of this thread, and how many times have you shifted the goal post since you supposedly made it?

 

They are German and they didn't work.

 

Herald

 

A modern bomb fuse is made of several components:

 

1) the fuse in the back of the bomb. It is designed to survive impact and integrates accelerometer to detect the impact and apply the selected delay. It can also integrate other functions like detecting the release/free flight timing (if a minimal free flight delay has been selected) or even counting layer impacts/void for advanced detonation mode (e.g. detonation on the third level of a bunker).

 

2) the communication box on the top of the bomb (called Initiator in your presentation, Arming Environments Sensor in the case of the FBM 21). Unlike the main fuse, they're not designed to survive an impact, their role is to interface with the plane weapon system to offer in-flight arming/disarming or more advanced functions if the carrying plane is compatible (e.g. in-flight selection of detonation delay. They can also relay inputs from other sensors like the DSU-33 in your latest presentation.

 

3) an optional proximity sensor for other than impact/delay modes, like airburst. In this case the sensor input is either directly fed to the base fuze or goes through the relay on top of the bomb. The FBM 21 is compatible with such a system and can accept either analog firing signals (like the DSU-33 pictured in your presentation) or digital sensor signals (which are less sensitive to external interferences, an issue that may become more and more important in EM-saturated battlefields).

 

Your statement that US fuses are NOW located in the midbody on the casing strong-back is simply nonsense.

 

The initiators are midbody sited and part of the fuses. The Thales fuses are incompatible with the initiators. What is so hard to understand?  

 

What's so hard in understanding that the FBM 21 are provided with their own midbody components? You can even see them in the 6-pack case on page 16 of the presentation you base your accusation on.

 

The German fuses (not French)

Seems I have misunderstood.

 

From what I understand as a non expert, both posters fail to mention is that the paveway is dual fused. That's why Blue Apple's argument was BS, because his link only showed a bomb with a tail fuse. The fact that the tail fuse on a Paveway can be French does not mean that the nose fuse is not American.

 

Note: the tail fuse/fuze MEHTF and the nose fuse/fuze as part of the GAINS interface connector 

  

I made the assumptions:

- The nose fuse seems an intergral part of the GAINS and it seems it cannot be exchanged for a French one.

- The GAINS is and American made component. 

Both may be or may not be wrong

 

If these assumptions are true, that would mean that a Paveway bomb would always contain an American fuse. I thought that this was what Herald was hinting at.

 

Then I see Herald's reply, and the link he posts doesn't make sense to me.

"http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2002fuze/robbins.pdf"

 

From what I understand to see on page 31 is a dual fused or multifused bomb.

- There is the nose fuse (DSU-33)

- There is the tail fuse (FMU-139 FMU-152)

- There is the data link to the airplane (FZU48/B/55/B), which allows the pilot to set the fuses for

  detonation after penetrating a bunker, proximity blast, impact detonation, etc....

  This datalink may be combined with a midway fuse in that case the bomb is multi fused.

 

From what I understand is that you use the nose fuse for proximity fusing and you use the tail fuse for Post-impact fusing.:

The data connection at the middle connects to the plane so you can select during flight how you want to fuse your bomb.

 

Source:

"http://www.ordnance.org/gpb.htm"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It was not my link, if I had posted a description of the FBM 21, I'd have used a better one.

 

It's not a fuze, the fuze is the part that detonates the explosive charge. Fuzes can generally accept external sensor inputs, either to tell it when it has to arm/disarm or even when to detonate.

 

In the case of the Paveway IV, the GAINS uses its GPS coordinate and its interface to the fuze in the back to tell when to arm and detonate if airburst at a selected altitude mode is selected.

 

I made the assumptions

-2 Earlier Paveways do not have a proximity fusing*1) only the Paveway IV has that.

-3 Paveways preclude the use of a nose fuse. (Not mentioned in the reply)

 

Sources:

"http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/my-pgm-for-a-fuze-paveway-iv-hits-trouble-in-britiain-03644/"

"http://www.ordnance.org/lgb.htm"

 

*1) What definition for fuze will be used?

"http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fuze"

A mechanical or electrical detonating device for setting off the bursting charge of a projectile, bomb, or torpedo

The sensor in the nose of the Paveway is part of the fuse.

The electronics if the FBM and timer are part of the fuse.

A continuous train of a combustible substance enclosed in a cord or cable for setting off an explosive charge by transmitting fire to it

The electronics if the FBM and timer are not part of the fuse.

 

As for moving the fuse midway on the bomb: I can see a likely reason why you'ld wanna do this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Errr change proximity fusing to airburst fusing....

 

 

 

and the FBM21 didn't work at China Lake.

 

Advertising based on French testing 2007. 

 

The AdA use Paveway IIs. I don't know if they are even coded for Paveway III, yet.  

 

Page 13.

The thing is that even the fuse is for several different situations (a multi function fuse). So even when the fuse fails to work as designed for a single situation does not mean it cannot be succesfully used for other situations.

 

For instance, if this fuse fails to work as designed at post impact fusing does not mean it cannot be used succesfully for detonating on impact fusing. Or for instance the use fails to work as designed at post  impact detonation on bunkers made of sand bags, but succeeds at post impact detonation on bunkers made of concrete.

 

So in order to prove that the Frech do not use the FBM21 fuse I would have to prove that the FBM21 fuse fails to work in all situations it is designed for. Since I cannot rule out that there is a situation where the FBM21 fuse works just fine, I cannot claim that the French do not use this fuse.

 

So I cannot rule out that for some situations on some targets the French use a Paveway 2 with a FBM21 fuse.

 

My assumption would be that for the targets where the FBM21 fuse does not work they use an American or German one.