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Subject: 2009 displays of the F-22 and the Rafale
Bluewings12    6/24/2009 5:03:48 PM
Let 's watch them first :-) The F-22 h*tp://www.air-attack.com/videos/single/cAhL7lJCk4I The Rafale : h*tp://www.dailymotion.com/user/ministeredeladefense/video/x9ma8h_demonstration-du-rafale_news Both aircrafts are pulling nice stuff . Rafale only does it twice faster . Explaination and details to follow . Cheers .
 
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warpig       8/4/2009 11:30:45 PM
It helps if you know what you look at, MK.



<a href=http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EtHdb5TtZaU/SRfrh3VxaTI/AAAAAAAAACw/hSH1_C-eiOc/s320/240px-APG-77-1A.jpg" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EtHdb5TtZaU/SRfrh3VxaTI/AAAAAAAAACw/hSH1_C-eiOc/s320/240px-APG-77-1A.jpg" width="384" height="312" /> 


 
 
You know what else helps?  Posts that aren't one freaking line long!
 
You know what else helps?  Actually typing out the words explaining what you mean, instead of posting a picture and leaving it to us to try and see the same thing you see and interpret it that same way you are interpreting it.
 
 
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Herald12345    Look at the shape of the array, WP. It has to be leaned to fit inside that F-22's nose!    8/5/2009 12:26:27 AM



It helps if you know what you look at, MK.







<a href=http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EtHdb5TtZaU/SRfrh3VxaTI/AAAAAAAAACw/hSH1_C-eiOc/s320/240px-APG-77-1A.jpg" src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EtHdb5TtZaU/SRfrh3VxaTI/AAAAAAAAACw/hSH1_C-eiOc/s320/240px-APG-77-1A.jpg" height="312" width="384" /> 







 

 

You know what else helps?  Posts that aren't one freaking line long!

 

You know what else helps?  Actually typing out the words explaining what you mean, instead of posting a picture and leaving it to us to try and see the same thing you see and interpret it that same way you are interpreting it.


 

Doggone, do I have to spell out everything?
 
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warpig       8/5/2009 12:40:03 AM
No, you don't, as you've amply demonstrated--that is, as long as you aren't interested in actually getting your point across and demonstrating that you are in fact correct in whatever you might be trying to say.  In this case, I don't know any different, so I'll accept what you say, but so far I see absolutely nothing about that picture that indicates the antenna needs to be tilted to get inside the F-22's nose.
 
 
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warpig       8/5/2009 12:47:34 AM
In particular, since I do not know the height of that array (and there is no ruler conveniently laid across it), and I do not know the interior height of the nose at the antenna station, I can not tell for myself that it would have to be tilted to fit.  Furthermore, if that is your point, I certainly do not consider it a reasonable expectation on your part that I would look at that photo and go google away until I manage to turn up those data in order to figure that out on my own.  If you know that's the case, you should have just said it.  If you know the actual numbers, or know where they can easily be found, you should have provided them.  Otherwise, at least make the assertion so we know what you're trying to say.  As far as I'm concerned, to do otherwise is poor form at best.
 
 
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Herald12345    Look at the shape of the array, WP. It has to be leaned to fit inside that F-22's nose!    8/5/2009 12:49:52 AM
http://www.noahshachtman.com/images/f22-1.jpg" height="500" width="375" />
 
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Herald12345       8/5/2009 1:01:51 AM
 
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Herald12345       8/5/2009 1:03:21 AM
 
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Herald12345    !@#$%^&*() !   8/5/2009 1:06:42 AM



check aid.


http://www.mikejamesmedia.com/media/f_22_project/000_research_and_setup/revell_lmco_compare/revell_f22_scans_08.jpg" height="437" width="800" />
 



Check your X/Y ratios and fit the radar in. 


http://www.mikejamesmedia.com/media/f_22_project/000_research_and_setup/revell_lmco_compare/revell_f22_scans_02.jpg" height="294" width="800" />
 



It has to lean.










 
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gf0012-aust       8/5/2009 2:16:09 AM

As a gift for our US readers

Some interesting confirmation in a public NATO document of what I have explained before:

link

19A.A.1 THE FOUR BASIC METHODS OF RCSR

There are generally only four basic techniques used for reducing RCS. They are:

? Shaping

? Radar absorbing materials

? Passive cancellation

? Active cancellation

Each of these methods have their advantages and disadvantages.

 


as you would know, that is an extremely dumbed down articulation of RCS management opportunity and principles.....  there are no longer 4 basic principles for RCS management. - and in real terms that hasn't been so for nearly a generation.  I can only suggest that the above is intended for a very very basic delivery of first order principles 


 
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Blue Apple       8/5/2009 2:38:11 AM
It goes directly to wrong choices which has been a continuous theme I have about most technological incompetence..
 
Until the end of the Cold War, French have tended to use their own standards which are close to NATO but not exactly the same. See the 68mm rockets, the weird twist of the 5.56 FAMAS rifle... This allowed them to make loads of money because their customers could not easily integrate NATO weapons and had to buy French ones.
 
That's not technical incompetence, it's commercial ingenuity at its best.
 
Of course, after the end of the Cold War, everyone started to buy US stuff and that strategy has backfired quite a bit (even at home, they can't find a commercial ammo supply that works ok in their assault rifle...).
 
 
In the case of the Rafale, radar is angled as well
It is the whole front part of the radar which is angled
You can see the reard attachment and angles , plus inclination of surface on the top
However angle is lower than in former US AESA display which means that optimisation is different.
After all Rafale is optimised for low altitude penetration.
 
Correst. ESA radar angle is a trade off between ground and air mode (e.g. the B-1 array is angled downard).
 
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