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Subject: 120mm AMS in Australian service
BLUIE006    6/2/2008 4:45:13 AM
The 120 AMS (120mm Armored Mortar System) is a single barrel, smoothbore 120mm mortar turret suitable for integration on medium weight armored vehicles such as M113 and Piranha III. It is operated completely under armor featuring reduced recoil and semi-automatic loading system which makes possible integration on most types of wheeled and tracked vehicles. The 120 Armored Mortar System mortar-turret fires existing and planned 120mm mortar ammunition and can be employed for direct fire engagements as well as indirect fire engagements. A 7.62mm machine gun and smoke grenade launchers provide additional self-defense capability. h*tp://www.deagel.com/Weapon-Stations/120-AMS_a001428001.aspx The 120 AMS has been integrated on M113A4 and Piranha III 8x8 chassis and is currently in service with the armies of Saudi Arabia and Australia. Australia / 20 Saudi Arabia / 73 I had no idea ADF used 120 mortar?? Is this part of MINCS(L) AMP 48.36 ? Army Mortar System Project The DMO site says its unapproved
 
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gf0012-aust       7/2/2008 4:26:50 PM

 re the post about possible earlier problems with titanium spades on M777, it rings a vague bell, obviously it's been sorted.

earlier spades weren't titanium.  it was a significant problem as an "ask" went out to everyone involved in NATO-"Friendlies" mil-research weapons programs to provide an assist.
 
it's been sorted now but it took a number of years....  some of the probs with the opticals were also related to it.
 
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ArtyEngineer    GF   7/2/2008 4:56:25 PM



 re the post about possible earlier problems with titanium spades on M777, it rings a vague bell, obviously it's been sorted.




earlier spades weren't titanium.  it was a significant problem as an "ask" went out to everyone involved in NATO-"Friendlies" mil-research weapons programs to provide an assist.

 

it's been sorted now but it took a number of years....  some of the probs with the opticals were also related to it.



Always been Titanium AFAIK GF, but went from fabrication from plate to single piece castings.
 
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gf0012-aust       7/3/2008 1:51:28 AM


Always been Titanium AFAIK GF, but went from fabrication from plate to single piece castings.


I'd have to defer to you on this one.  I was under the impression that the original mule was steel  and that it was when they went to plate and frame Ti that other recoil and mass management issues got triggered.  The plates had the crap shaken out of them and hence Ti billet solution was developed - It's been 8 years though since I was on the peripherary.....  IIRC the table took a hammering as well.
 
on another note, if you need formable and complex shape Ti, then drop me a line. :)
 
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ArtyEngineer    GF   7/3/2008 2:03:47 AM
The stories I could tell!!!!! I will say this (Probably get in trouble for it but oh well).  Back in the early day before the recoil system was "Optimised" and before we really understood the various loads the ancilliary equipment on the weapon needed to be designed to withstand we played a little game were we drew circles in the sand around the gun an took bets on what would blow off and land where!!!! 
 
Its one hell of a piece of gear right now though.  And proving it on a daily basis.
 
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BLUIE006       7/4/2008 12:36:42 AM
The revised scope of AMP48.36 remains unapproved. Army Headquarters (AHQ) have completed the development work and will shortly commence seeking the required approvals. Further information will be provided as it becomes available..
 
Come on guys.. you can do it...
 
DPICM round will carry 54 M80 Sub munitions, doubling the lethality of the 120 mm high-explosive round.
 

PGMM 120 mm mortar with extended-range glide capability will be optimized to defeat threats behind protective cover, such as crew-served weapon stations, command posts and IED observers using fortified positions. The ability to take out precision targets in urban environments will be critical in future conflicts.

The nature of future threats combined with operations in urban environments will require PGMM?s surgical indirect fire capability to minimize collateral damage and still allow commanders to destroy enemy targets that are close to sensitive cultural areas. PGMM will provide dramatic increases the survivability of friendly forces.
 

The new capability provided by PGMM will defeat these targets without requiring a close-range attack.

The single-shot lethality of PGMM makes it exceptionally cost-effective.
 
The ability an integrate 120mm mortar into a variety of platforms.
 
The reduced manning requirements of mortar systems combined with modern munitions
 
 
I'm sure you there plenty more benifts.....  GET SELLING
 
 
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neutralizer       7/4/2008 4:15:25 AM
You can forget DPICM, unless the govt is about to do a U turn on Dublin.
 
The reduced manning bit is based on the usual chalk and cheese comparison - infantry operated mortars which can have lots of quiet time and a 24 x 365 fire support system. 
 
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bazza84       7/7/2008 9:18:47 PM
"As I understand it Aust originally purchased 15,000 rds 105mm Fd Mk2 (which is what L118 uses) and the plan was for local production.  However, this never eventuated for reasons that aren't at all clear but still seems to rile some people."
 
 
As far as I can tell there is some local 105mm manufacture (though not the Fd Mk2). 
link />
Whether this has anything to do with the apparent reluctance that govt has with getting rid of the Hamels I don't know.
 
baz
 
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bazza84       7/7/2008 11:04:39 PM
"As I understand it Aust originally purchased 15,000 rds 105mm Fd Mk2 (which is what L118 uses) and the plan was for local production.  However, this never eventuated for reasons that aren't at all clear but still seems to rile some people."
 
 
As far as I can tell there is some local 105mm manufacture (though not the Fd Mk2). 
link />
Whether this has anything to do with the apparent reluctance that govt has with getting rid of the Hamels I don't know.
 
baz
 
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neutralizer       7/8/2008 6:25:29 AM
Over the years Aust has produced reasonably large qtys of 105mm M1 (AKA 1935 pattern, AKA UK 105mm How) type ammo.  IIRC during Vietnam it was also contracted to produce this ammo for the US.
 
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