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Subject: Why does ASRAAM suck?
Shaken    5/5/2004 6:42:25 PM
Looking past the unfortunate acronym selection, what reasons do people have for denegrating the ASRAAM? On paper, it looks like a fine weapon. (There was a noteworthy moment in the AIM-9X vs R-73 discussion when Boris and USN_Mid agreed on ASRAAM as a non-competitor without hesitation).
 
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Heorot    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   6/28/2004 7:57:27 PM
As a follow up to my last post, I am old enough to remember the original deal. Not for a minute did I believe that it would happen. I don't even believe that the politicians that signed the deal beleiaved it either. It was just Europolitics. And as you said, the other European countries all fell out of bed as soon as they could.
 
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displacedjim    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   6/28/2004 8:42:38 PM
"And as you said, the other European countries all fell out of bed as soon as they could" Typical European Pork Barrel politics. Displacedjim
 
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Heorot    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   6/29/2004 8:13:11 AM
As I understand the term, Pork Barrel politics is about placing work/money with your own people. By dropping out of ASRAAM, those countries lost the opportunity to do that. Instead the US or Britain will get the money depending on which missile is chosen to equip their forces. Therefore the miguided Europeans were NOT indulging in Pork Barrel politics. They were just being cheapskates. The truth is that only Britain and France in Europe are capable of pulling off this kind of project; the others would have been picking up the scraps while paying through the nose for the priviledge.
 
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Shaken    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   6/29/2004 9:06:47 PM
>> (Heorot) >> They were just being cheapskates. The truth is that only Britain and France in Europe are capable of pulling off this kind of project; the others would have been picking up the scraps while paying through the nose for the priviledge (Shaken) The German team working on IRIS-T might object to this statement. Of course, they aren't in service yet either... -- Shaken - out --
 
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Heorot    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   6/30/2004 7:52:14 AM
They may be making IRIS-T but I am not convinced that it will outperform AIM9X or ASRAAM. My mind goes back to the Alpha jet trainer built in competition to the Hawk. On paper a good aircraft; in reality it sucked.
 
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stim    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   7/1/2004 9:32:01 AM
"On paper a good aircraft; in reality it sucked" How did it suck?
 
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Heorot    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   7/2/2004 8:55:19 AM
I can't remember the details now. Perhaps sucked is a little extreme; excessively ordinary would probably be a better description. It was produced in competition with the Hawk and where the Hawk went on to be sold all over the world in large numbers(20 countries including the US), the Alpha jet sold to only 10 countries, most of which had French connections and small requirements. The Hawk is still in production while thae Alpha line was closed down some years ago. To return to the original topic, I made that remark to shoe that Britain and France have a track record of producing good missiles while the countries participating in IRIS-T have no track record at all.
 
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HJ    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   12/20/2004 9:18:44 PM
The general criticsm of ASRAAM is that it didn't address R-73 performance in the close-in (across the circle) fight after it become better known in the west. The 3 word-beaters in the close-in fight are considered to be the AA-11, Python IV and AIM-9X.
 
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Bluewings    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   4/28/2005 3:35:33 PM
Quote : "The 3 word-beaters in the close-in fight are considered to be the AA-11, Python IV and AIM-9X." MICA IR is up there too . Same performance than Python IV and far greater range . Cheers .
 
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Shooter    RE:Why does ASRAAM suck?   5/12/2005 11:43:43 PM
">Actually, ASRAAM v AIM9X should never have happened. The US and Europe agreed tha the US would develop AMRAAM and Eurpope would develop ASRAAM. Both parties signed a MOU that they would buy each others missile, but as usual, the Americans reneged on the deal and went for their own missile rather than buy European.<" THE TRUTH OF IT IS THAT THE DEVELOPMENT WAS SO FAR BEHIND that they had no choise but to drop it. The ASRAAM program only got well with the adoption of the US seeker from Huges. As a second point, it is heavier than -9X and thus has a larger impact on air craft performance. This is not a small thing and the newest idea being tested is four finless AIM-9Xs in each side bay of the F-22. 1,700 pound in styead of 440! Thirdly, the AMRAAM is a very capable close range missile and this means that you can cary more long range rounds with out selling your self short. I did not say it was AS good as the-9X, just very good. And both have advanced targeting modes that make them much more lethal than their competiters!
 
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