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Subject: Israel
A Patriot    12/12/2004 9:37:46 PM
My friend beleives that Israel is the only country which could stand longer in a conventional against the US than any other country on Earth. He is clearly "retarted" (as he called me for not thinking what he thought, lol). I have tried and tried again to tell him that Israel could not stand or even consider holding off the US and that countries such as France and Britain could defeat Israel (if Cruise missle theory works as suggested in the Israel vs Britain board then it would be over before it started, if you get my drift) in a long term war if not very short. I told him, all the u.s has to do is not help fund their military, then they'll colapse, blokade them and let their neighbours pick at them till they have no choice but to surrender, or destroy their airfields which there aren't many of. Yet he still thinks Israel could last longer than Germany, Britain, France, China, NK and Japan... is he crazy? or am I crazy? My friend claims his history teacher in gr.10 said that israel was by far the most advanced nation on earth (more advanced than US, Britain, France, Germany and japan) because they are always at war, and that the only country that can take them on is the u.s, and that the u.s would suffer and it's economy would be devistated in such a war..... I think that's a bowl o rubish
 
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AchtungLagg    RE:Israel   12/12/2004 11:06:50 PM
israel is very advanced in military, agricultural, electronic engineering, material engineering, biological science. this is because israel is like a mini america of our times. its a melting pot of jews from all over the world that come there with their skills, especially the 1million or so soviet expatriates who were mostly very highly educated. so israel does have its areas of expertise. as far as israel vs the us, yes i agree with you, israel does not have the best infrastructure to deal very well in a war vs the USA. as for damage to the US, theyd prly be able to knock out one or two major cities, but the same could be said for about 10 other countries in that situation.
 
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Aeb4ever    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 1:44:37 AM
If Israel wanted to attack the USA directly (no WMDs) it would have a very hard time and would do miniscule damadge. If the USA attacked Israel (again, no WMDs) the USA could devestate the country. Isreal's inteligence network (Mossod) has shown itself to be a seriuse threat. The other two threats Isreal is to the USA is using WMDs (or handing them off to USA's enemys), and selling/giving its tecnolagy to one of the USA's compediters (ex. China).
 
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trib    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 3:47:12 AM
the Idea of Israel giving WMD to USA enemy's is somewhat strange, except asian country, US enemy's are mainly arab country, so I don't think Israel would hand them that kind of weaponry. in an all out war (without WMD) US can crush Israel on the military field but they won't be able to stay there.
 
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Covaysh    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 9:29:08 AM
Israel could not do an offensive war because it's navy is limited... well pretty much to the mediterranean. It is unknown if they do have ICBM's although they most likely do. But Israel could hold off against them. It would be too hard for America to bring in it's navy. And Israel's Air Force is supposed to be the best. It would be very hard to even occupy the country, seeing as how the entire country knows how to weild a gun and knows military tactics. Israel could win provided that they use their army for defensive purposes.
 
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french stratege    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 1:47:25 PM
it is stupid to think that israeli weapon would be so effective against US: US knows the software they put in their AGP 68 radar, Amraam, or other systems.And Israelis system would be less effective if not completly jammed in BVR. US air dominance would be quickly total. Even their IRBM could be intercepted by SM3 antimissiles from Aegis cruisers. Israel is quite good unless US tolerate or support them.
 
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A Patriot    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 3:14:41 PM
I know Israel could do no harm what so ever physicaly to the U.S soil. If the U.S defeats Israel, it won't be the u.s doing the occupying it will be the arabs. What i'm talking about is, my friend said if the U.S had to invade or forcefully demobilize a country, Israel would be the most difficult to defeat. That means Israel is harder to defeat than China, India, Japan, UK, France and Germany... Would you agree with my friend? I most certainly do not. If you do agree with my friend could you please explain why this would be so?
 
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Covaysh    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 8:28:09 PM
Ok we're talking about a country with reportedly the best trained Air Force in the world. The country that created UAV's as well as probably hundreds of other Military technologies. Israel knows just as much of the USA of the technologies, if not more. After all Israel creates lots of new technologies. Wasn't Israel the one that created the gun that peeks and fires around corners? My point is Israel is just as advanced in Tactics and SUperiority. You also must remember that Israel's Military is built for defense... Israel has lot's of Mountains and Deserts which the Merkava is built for. As i also said you are dealing with a 5.5 million jews that know how to use a gun and depending on their age remembers something from their military and tactics. Thus the Guerilla War will be very fearsome if the Americans land. As well as you have to take into account politcal instability in America. Jew's hold lots of power, and if American detains them for the duration of the war it could cripple the USA in New York and California one of the bigger money states. Then you got those evangelists. Anyways i know the topic is on a 1v1 military. In conclusion, It would be very hard for America to land and would be even harder to occupy. The cost of occupying it would be astronomical. Probably the same thing with China, NK and Iran. I admit that American would probably defeat them, but America wouldn't stay very long... and before long Israel will have rebuilt it's military again. Plus their nukes wouldn't hurt. ;)
 
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A Patriot    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 9:02:05 PM
Rebuild it's military with what? with u.s Money? lol ;) Covayash, Do you really think the u.s would have to land in Israel to defeat Israel? Just don't give them any funding or anymore weapons get control of the air by destroying their runways and blokade them. Then if the u.s WANTED to land somewhere they have control of the air so they could establish a base somewhere to keep Israel in line. what I think they could do is destroy all your aircraft while they're on the ground, destroy their source of income and let the 100's of millions of arabs to deal with someone at their own tech level... Does anyone have any suggestions on how this conflict would unfold, and how it would compare to fighting china or somthing?
 
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Covaysh    RE:Israel   12/13/2004 10:04:21 PM
Ah... so we're including money dependence in it? Then fine i play political dissedence. Lots of the high powers in America are Jewish add in the Evangelists and you just put America into a civil war with a breaking economy now. Now i think Israel could defiently win. Gotta think politics into this... As to the blockade and runway destruction... if Israel is at war with USA, do you really think they wouldn't be prepared for this? I think Israel could hold it's own... American can pull out the money from Israel, but America would be in civil war at end. Plus there are some other factos. But civil war is the main one.
 
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USN-MID    RE:Israel   12/14/2004 12:02:59 AM
You really think Jews would create a civil war in the United States? You do realize they're a tiny tiny fraction of the total population right? And you'd have to assume we'd have a decent reason for invading Israel or it simply wouldn't happen to begin with. Israel does not have access to protected US technologies like AMRAAM software. They don't really know exactly how it works, while we do. We can spoof OUR systems, they at best have manufacturer data on "proper use." Same goes for radars. But all that's really pointless. In the end, we have something Israel cannot possibly defend adequately against. A TON of TLAMs...AT SEA. Launch those m-fers out, about a thousnad, with various munitions types, blanketing their cities with explosives, disabling their runways, nailing airfield refueling assets, sub pens, Patriot sites, etc. Once that's done, naval air moves on in and begins dropping bombs do further reduce the cities to rubble. If necessary, we could drop off the 6-8 or so MEUs we can spring up at one time. Not to invade though. Mainly to add artillery to the bombardment. Just stay constantly out of range, bombing and shelling away. Throw in naval air tossing SLAM-ERs from far out. That's how to deal with small, densely defended nations. That doesn't even account for the USAF bombers. Or the USAF fighters/fighter-bombers that the Arabs would almost definitely give basing rights to, seeing as how they're going to be beating on Israel. Same goes for Army divisions. But it all begins with the swarm of cruise missiles to "crack the shell." There's no system in the world operational that can defend a nation from hundreds and hundreds of cruise missiles. Nothing beats extremely long range unmanned kamikazes for kicking down the door. And no casualties in the process too. Even better...we can send ships back to rearm. It'd be like the 8th Air Force over Germany...only we'd be hitting what we want, and airmen don't die. Only the enemy. Of course, you'd have massive collateral damage, as we'd be bombing CITIES.
 
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