Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system

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macawman RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 8/21/2002 1:42:54 PM

Saddam is believed to have had aproximately 12 launchers left at the end of the war according to defectors and Frontline. No Iraqi SCUD launchers were destroyed by air/ground interdiction. No matter how ineffective the PAC 1s performance was they did keep Israel out of the war. This was their best and most worthy achievement.

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Horthy RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 8/22/2002 1:57:27 AM

Actually, I believe it was 19 launchers, just read that in Adrian Weale's "Secret Warfare". He also agrees that none were destroyed either by SAS/Delta or by airstrikes. An interesting opinion of his, which I tend to second, is that what kept Israel out of the war was not any weapon system but their own pragmatism. What would they gain by dissolving the coalition by entering the war? After all that would only help their enemies, the Iraqis. Things would have looked different with a WMD attack, but as it was, I think they were content with getting the choice of a few targets for the USAF to destroy.

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macawman RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 9/1/2002 5:10:37 PM

Good point. Early on the Israelis could see that the Pac 1s were not stopping anything and they still stayed out it.

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bsl RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 9/2/2002 7:46:22 PM

Macawman, "the PAC 1s performance was they did keep Israel out of the war." The real story is somewhere between "sorta" and "not really". The missiles were aimed at and landing in Israel. A very small country whose military is it's adult male population. IOW, nothing concerning the Scuds was really secret. Everyone knew pretty well what was going on. It was really mostly Americans who were fooled into thinking the Patriots were effective. Israelis knew different. The reason there was no retaliation was extremely heavy American pressure combined with the fact that the Scuds did very little damage. And, as it was, the issue was very close. It won't be duplicated. Expect retaliation for any attack. Extremely heavy retaliation for anything remotely resembling WMD. Israel lost a lot of credibility by not shooting back last time and there's a school of thought which blames that inaction for the present state of affairs. There's a different government in power in Israel. Also, a different government in power in America. James Baker is no longer in government.

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macawman RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 9/3/2002 12:04:22 AM

Does any know if those 12 to 19 Iraqi mod SCUDs launchers were destroyed by the WMD teams sent to Iraq by the UN? I saw TV film of missile frames being crushed but no transporter erector launchers (TEls). The Iraqi SCUDS were modified by their "technical advisers" for greater range and payload. A first generation SCUD A had a typical range of 300 km. The Iraqi SCUDs were a 3 to 2 conversion modification with the added sections welded on to make a longer more fuel and payload capable ballistic missile. This conversion required a special modified TEL longer and heavier than the Soviet SCUD A mobile launcher. What this SCUD conversion gained in range it lost in accuracy. It was strictly a "City Buster" with a cep. of app. 5 miles. Israel and any neighboring countries who side with us on this pending Iraqi invasion have good reason to be concerned about C & BW SCUD warheads for Saddam knows his chance of survival is very slim.

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Soren Mateo RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 9/11/2002 5:02:00 AM

Isn't the PAC-3 with the advanced radar and so on, designed to surpass the soviet s-400, and so that the soviets can no longer claim they have the best SAM in the world?

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macawman RE:Regarding Scuds and the Patriot Anti-missile system 9/14/2002 12:29:25 AM

We will find that out only in the next conflict where AD is crucial to one of our client countries ie. Israel, Tawain, S. Korea, and/or probably our own military at one of the regional theater AOs.

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