.357 Magnum stopping power

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Subject: .357 Magnum stopping power
GOP 3/12/2007 10:24:42 PM

Whatsup guys? What kind of Self defense round is the .357 mag? Some of you may know that I'm 17, but I'm a gun nut, and love the S&W 686 with 4 inch barrel in .357 mag/.38 special. I'd use the gun almost completely for shooting at the range, but when I turn 21 I plan on getting my CCW license/pistol permit so it would then be used legally as a self-defense weapon. Just curious what your thoughts on the round is. The reason I like it is because it's stainless steal, and therefore won't rust (we own a fishing boat and it may be used by my Dad on the boat as a Self-Defense weapon). It's also highly, highly thought of in the NSW community (most SEALs don't like the the Sig P226 Navy, because they basically rust at the sound of "salt water")

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Jeff_F_F 3/16/2007 11:30:09 PM

If Britain is so safe why does it have so much higher crime rates than the US? And why is it that non violent crimes are not that much more common in Britain than the US, while violent crime rates are much higher? Maybe because criminals in the US prefer not to confront their victims because they might have a gun? Just a thought.

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longrifle 3/16/2007 11:40:53 PM

"Never have I needed a gun for self defence."

In 43 static line parachute jumps never did I need my reserve parachute.

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hist_ed 3/18/2007 2:17:47 AM

Hey GOP I'll weigh in a bit.

#1 Don't apologize for liking guns. A while ago there was a thread that debated something like the question "Was the rise of firearms a good idea?" My answer: Yes. Firearms democratized the use of force. Prior to the advent of firearms, competant, deadly force was almost exclusively possesed by ruling elites and those they paid to keep them in power. Guns meant that the people had a better chance at resisting the aristocracy. The Founders loved guns and thought that the prevelance of guns among the American colonists was a significant factor in our victory in the Revolution.

#2 (and on this I can't say I'm an expert, but I have been shooting handguns for about 20 years) Right now you shouldn't fix yourself on a single caliber or type of weapon. Try out as many as you can. If there is a range that has a selection of guns to rent then go and shoot a bunch of them before you settle on one. Talk to gun salesmen and the people running the range (and others) and be honest ("I want a hangun, I think I want a .357 but before I buy I want to try a few others."). In my experience most gun shop employees are a little guarded at first, but one you get them talking they like nothing more than discussing their favorite.

One of the first handguns I owned was a cheap 9mm called a Star BM (looks a lot like a small 1911). I traded it in on a really nice Baretta after owning it for a couple of years. I've shot many others since: revolvers, high capacity 9mms, .45, even a Desert Eagle, but nothing ever seemed to be quite as comfortable as that Star. I saw another Star 9mm at a shop a year or so ago and bought it again on a whim. 20 years later I am still more comfortable with it that other handguns. After getting it tuned up I shoot as good or better groups with it than with guns costing 5 times as much (it was $200). I'm not saying you should run out and buy this gun, just that you should keep an open mind about what works for you and try different things.

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Horsesoldier 3/18/2007 9:41:46 AM

hist_ed's point #2 is excellent advice when looking at handguns for personal use and self-defense. Ultimately it boils down to what fits your hand and works best for you. Pretty much all major reputable manufacturers these days deliver excellent reliability and performance in their weapons (there are occasional exceptions to this, either in terms of designs or an individual weapon that has some issues), so weapon selection largely boils down to what fits your hand and works best for you.

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Ehran 3/19/2007 11:55:06 AM

is america that dangerous that you have to have a gun?

Oh please... what sort of a stupid argumentative comment is that? You may as well have just gone up to a Southern American and said "Nascar sucks"....

but nascar does suck ;)

listening to americans talk about their self defense carries is enough to make you wonder just what they are afraid of.

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Yimmy 3/19/2007 4:37:52 PM

but nascar does suck ;)

listening to americans talk about their self defense carries is enough to make you wonder just what they are afraid of.

I read the odd gun-forum from time to time, and it is always a good laugh when the "Post pictures of your daily carry options" thread turns up.

You would be amazed at the amount of crap these people carry on their person. None of it is worth squat either. If someone goes up behind them and hits them over the head with a stick, their "H&K 9mm semi-compact automatic with the ivory grips option" is going to account for nothing. While if someone doesn't like them and means them harm, all they need do is run them over when they are crossing the road, or worse, shoot them from 200m's away with their accurised AR15.

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RockyMTNClimber Self Defense is a right. 3/19/2007 5:52:41 PM

but nascar does suck ;)

listening to americans talk about their self defense carries is enough to make you wonder just what they are afraid of.

I read the odd gun-forum from time to time, and it is always a good laugh when the "Post pictures of your daily carry options" thread turns up.

Smarmy comments would not have helped these armed citizens Yimmy. Fortunately

they live in a land where self defense is an option. Personal Freedom Rocks!

Gerry Steckmyer and his wife awoke to a loud commotion and were shocked by what they saw out their bedroom window—a deranged man was shouting and jumping on the roof of their car. Police say that when Mr. Steckmyer opened the window and shouted at the man to get off the car, the man walked toward the house and started trying to break in. He kicked the home’s front door and slammed his shoulder into it. Steckmyer repeatedly told the man to leave and warned that police were on the way, but there was no stopping the man’s odd behavior. He grabbed a 5-gallon water cooler bottle, smashed in a window and entered the home. When the intruder neared the master bedroom, Steckmyer shot him with a handgun, killing him. (The Press Democrat, Santa Rosa, CA, 12/18/06)

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A 21-year-old man was eating pizza with his mother and a friend when someone knocked on the door. According to police, when the friend opened the door, two intruders burst inside and put a gun to his head. The man’s mother sought refuge in a bedroom while he ran downstairs to retrieve a firearm. Confused, one of the intruders asked where everyone went, then said he’d kill anyone he found. In response to the threat, the 21-year-old reemerged, shooting and killing one intruder and causing his accomplice to flee. (Post-Tribune, Merrillville, IN, 12/03/06)

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Police say a 16-year-old gang member wearing a ski mask and toting a .22 rifle knocked on a front door north of Chicago one night. Inside,
Saffiyya Darr and her husband called out to ask who it was, but got no reply. Several minutes later they heard a loud sound coming from their back door, and Darr ran to her bedroom to get a 9 mm pistol. When the suspect forced his way inside, she shot him twice. He died at the scene. “If you are sitting at home at night and someone kicks the door open, you have the right to defend yourself,” said Police Chief Douglas Malcolm. (Lake
Country News-Sun, Waukegan, IL, 12/04/06)

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There is a sign on Abel Sisneros’ home warning, “Nothing inside is worth risking your life for. Owners of this property are highly skilled to protect life, liberty and property from criminal attacks.” Authorities, however, say an intruder failed to heed the warning. Sisneros heard a pounding at the front door and grabbed his 9 mm handgun as a precaution. He was at the top of the stairs when the suspect broke through the locked front door. Sisneros fired two shots. The wounded burglar groaned and ran to the back of the house until police arrested him. “He couldn’t get out of the back [of the home], and he knew I was still in the front of the house, so he was trapped,” Sisneros explained. (The Fort-Worth Star-Telegram, Fort Worth, TX, 12/22/06)

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Horsesoldier 3/19/2007 7:40:58 PM

I read the odd gun-forum from time to time, and it is always a good laugh when the "Post pictures of your daily carry options" thread turns up.

Without effective means of self-defense, any old fellow can walk up to your face and hit you over the head and . . . what can you do about it? What about a gang of, say, six or seven guys who really want your wallet, your car, your girlfriend?

The way I look it is like this -- the odds of the above or anything similar, are remote and in the realm of a "worst case scenario." Consequently, being legally permitted to carry a concealed firearm, the odds of me ever having to draw a firearm to defend myself (much less discharge it) are pretty remote as well (in part, however, because my daily routine and behavior mitigate threats long before I'm ever about to do a personal High Noon moment). With 300 million or so people in the US and a violent crime rate of about 4 victims per 1000 people, I can likely go my entire life without being the victim of a robbery, assault, etc.

But the odds of a cop standing helpfully next to me when a worst case scenario occurs are infinitely less likely than the chance I'll have to deal with a worst case scenario.

Put another way -- the 4/1000 victims of violent crime each year is quite a bit more impressive than the 24,000 or 25,000 Americans killed or injured each year in house fires, and I don't see any point in throwing away my smoke alarm even though I'm much less likely to be a victim of a house fire than a violent criminal.

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Yimmy 3/19/2007 10:08:37 PM

Rocky, I knew exactly what your post was saying before I read it. Stereotypes can be cruel, if deserved thing. :)

It is a fair argument, that if you have a gun it is easier to defend yourself. However the attacker will always have the inititive. It will always be far more likely that the attacker knocks you down, your being armed or otherwise, if he aims to. As such it is far more likely that your gun will end up in the criminals hands, and possibly be used in a future crime, than of your using it to defend yourself.

Me, if it was legal for me to carry a firearm, I would. But only because I knew that many people, far stupider than myself, would also be carrying firearms.

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RockyMTNClimber 3/19/2007 11:04:41 PM

Rocky, I knew exactly what your post was saying before I read it. Stereotypes can be cruel, if deserved thing. :)

Me, if it was legal for me to carry a firearm, I would. But only because I knew that many people, far stupider than myself, would also be carrying firearms.

You have made a series of comments that have been shown to be simply silly liberal gibberish. In fact the statistics don't support your assertions so once again you silly depricating barbs.

The facts remain to support themselves, as has been demonstrated again.

Check Six

Rocky

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