Brit JIN

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lightningtest RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? 6/17/2005 6:15:46 AM

whats a zero pack?

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gf0012-aust RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? 6/17/2005 6:31:41 AM

"whats a zero pack?" It's a milspec rated container. www.zerocases.com basically a lot of the portable gear gets carted in cases like this.

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gf0012-aust RE:Brit JIN ... 6/17/2005 6:38:19 AM

"Its just a thought but perhaps the same power supply modules required to provide electric armour may when joined up be used to zap IED's. It all depend on the current/voltage needed for each job (+ the inductance of the connections). " to paraphrase cleopatra, "power is a pain in the asp" ;) The number of new technologies that are coming on board means that portable power is a huge issue. WRT to explosive management devices that means a few things. Portable power preferred If hard wired, then it means heavy shielding to reduce emissions It wireless control, then there will be a whole pile of restrictions in place, bandwidth, frequency issues, signal integrity, security (to stop signal hijacking etc...) all cables and connectors will need to be milspec and I imagine that in this case, there will be waterproofing provisions, overpressure provisions etc... Any system that uses existing portable power packs will probably be popular as it means that logistics isn't complicated. The UK is actually really tough at this kind of thing, so you'll get advice thats worth listening to.

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lightningtest RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? 6/17/2005 7:04:09 AM

with 24V DC available a 5kA generator (typical 6.4/70 microsecond lightning pulse) could fit into one of the 2m x 1.0m x0.8m modular cases. link We would have to insulate things with oil which I think would mean a weight of ~100kg. How ever drain the oil and it may be 20kg lighter. If the next step up is a 20ft ISO shipping container then it is possible to provide upto 200kA for US$1.5million (yeh right! I hear you say already done by the JIN). However cost/rough handling requirements and low maintanance requirements mean such a 200kA generator would be unsuited for miltary use. Time will tell with the JIN. Joining many zero cases together would be very inefficent -but possible if the current can rise to peak over a longer time. I am still thinking of a couple of ~1.2m cube pallet sized loads that could be slid into the back ot a APC/IFV. Individually the weight of the pallets would be such 4 (Infantry) men could heave them. The insulated generator output could then be fed out along/through the tube most such vehicles already have installed. Mounting a UV laser head in the breach and shining it up the tube to the target. A interesting design problem which is to ensure the current flashes down to ground onto then IED rather than back up the barrel through the APC/IFV to the generator earth remains.

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perfectgeneral RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? 6/17/2005 7:15:11 AM

I don't see why you need the UV laser. Tasers fire wires with little spikes on them that stick into the target. If the first few metres of the wires run up plastic pipes there should be no spark back to the genny.

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gf0012-aust RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? - where's EW3? 6/17/2005 7:17:24 AM

"with 24V DC available a 5kA generator (typical 6.4/70 microsecond lightning pulse) could fit into one of the 2m x 1.0m x0.8m modular cases. link We would have to insulate things with oil which I think would mean a weight of ~100kg. How ever drain the oil and it may be 20kg lighter. " even better if you're using an oil type already in use by the military - again it's a logistics issue "If the next step up is a 20ft ISO shipping container then it is possible to provide upto 200kA for US$1.5million (yeh right! I hear you say already done by the JIN)." How big is it? Can't it be broken down into sub components for cartage? "I am still thinking of a couple of ~1.2m cube pallet sized loads that could be slid into the back ot a APC/IFV. Individually the weight of the pallets would be such 4 (Infantry) men could heave them. The insulated generator output could then be fed out along/through the tube most such vehicles already have installed. Mounting a UV laser head in the breach and shining it up the tube to the target." just curious, do you require constant power, or could you use impulse - ie as in stored via a HD capacitor? "A interesting design problem which is to ensure the current flashes down to ground onto then IED rather than back up the barrel through the APC/IFV to the generator earth remains. " isn't that a ground earth problem? it's also possible that you create a ground earth loop - and that then creates a different but new problem. you should probably see if someone like EW3 can pop in at this point. he's a bit more of the specialist when it comes to sparking/non sparking gear. ;)

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gf0012-aust RE:Brit JIN ... a dumb idea? 6/17/2005 7:19:14 AM

"I don't see why you need the UV laser. Tasers fire wires with little spikes on them that stick into the target. If the first few metres of the wires run up plastic pipes there should be no spark back to the genny." IMV it's too high a current and there is no guarantee that you will spike the IED and make the solid connection. They're usually artillery shells converted to bombs. get it wrong and you blow the ferk out of the neighbourhood in a manner that makes you an unwelcome guest.

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gf0012-aust lightningtest 6/17/2005 7:59:19 AM

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lightningtest RE:lightningtest 6/17/2005 8:28:20 AM

Thanks for the head up. I'll try to russle up the £600 quid. The UV laser may not be essential, anthing which created a focused ionised path moments (microseconds) before the main current pulse would do. Maybe microwaves, perhaps x-rays/gamma rays.... The idear of sending a light pulse down the middle of a long metallic tube and thence onto the IED just seemed doable. Apparently the JIN does it and so do some other commerical devices.

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gf0012-aust RE:lightningtest 6/17/2005 8:36:57 AM

is there any basic info in the public domain?

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