"cheese eating surrender monkeys" (a term first hurled against the French early in World War II).

 

Errrrrr.... no, actually, it originated with the Simpsons (Willie the scot gardener IIRC), Matt Groening actually apologized for the show being to "blame" for this catchphrase - kinda like the infamous 'I'd rather have a german division in front of me, than a french division behind me' attributed to Patton (who was actually still with the WWI very positive image of the french fighting spirit), while it originated from an Us talkshow.

 

French are well trained, equipped and led.

 

This is very much left to debate; training & leadership (at least on a tacticel level, the 2008 ambush and the 9+1 french marines and FFL medic killed were ultimately casualties of the very short-sighted and undecisive attitude from the powers-that-be, sending troops into a combat zone with a peace-keeping equipment and supposed mission) should be ok, since the french army actually has a rather good tradition on those... BUT, the french army also is basically bankrupted, training has declined over the last decade (frontline troops like those sent to afghanistan must have retained more quality then the rest of the army, obviously), and, most importantly, equipment is badly aging (the Famas rifles are falling to piece from being 30 years old with no upgrade and no replacement, there have been some serious issues with the outsourcing of the Famas-specific 5.56 ammo), largely incompatible with Nato standards (a left-over from the gaullist era, IE the law of unintented consequences), and worse, out of phase with afghan combat realities (lack of good, lightweight comms, lack of firepower, inadequate body-armor, crappy general quality of gear,)... the french army has had the very unpleasant obligation of being faced with its own material shortage/obselescence, that have accumulated since 1981, and accelerated since the hurried professionalization of the late 90's (yet another great decision by chirac...).

 

Just my 0.02. No beef against the french soldiers, who are a far cry from that insulting "cheese..." stereotype, but the french army as a "tool" has been let down HARD by the various gvts since a few decades (not to mention the larger breakdown of french civil society, the complete lack of patriotism, the disdain about the armed force from "Blue" France,...), and they have to do with a whole lot less, and to scrounge and improvise as they go. 

 

Think "brit army", but worse.

If the entire world - including the French - had shown that they were willing to stand up to both Saddam and Terrorists after the Liberation - there wouldn't have been any meaningful opposition in Iraq - and we wouldn't now be fighting in Afghanistan.

I never read something so hilarious on this site and I saw a lot on it, did you live in a cave the past 10 years? saying "we wouldn't now be fighting in Afghanistan" is quite stupid and show you total lack of knowledge of the situation ... irak was not necessary while Astan was for a long ass time, but I guess you are that kind of people called "utile idiot"by any gov please keep watching fox news and give us your "deep" analysis it's plain BS but at least you will make laugh a few people here.

 

jak267   , yeah, that's true on some level, though I doubt it would have had much effect in the real world - the insurgency was planned as a "stay behind army" by saddam & co right from before the actual invasion, with cash & weaponry pre-positioned all over the place and fall-back networks in syria, IIUC.

Later on, you add iran & the jihadi networks, the very badly managed 2003-2006 period, and you have the iraqi insurgency result. Good thing the GWB & his surge literally snatched victory from the jaws of defeat, but with hindsight, what was done then should have been done from the start, so the administration wouldn't have had to burn all its political capital defending this war against the libs (whose UNFORGIVABLE fault is to have willingly polarized this war to get political benefits) and  overseas ennemies.

 

AND, while the US public has been led by the US officials to believe France was the spearhead of the opposition to the OIF, the real movers & shakers were Germany (schroder, aka putin's bitch) & Russia (comrade vlad)... who were very happy to leave the stage open for the gaullist windbag "de villepin" (dominique galouzeau, if you want to stick to his real family name, not the phony recently bought nobility title) and the crooked arab lover/whore chirac to spew hot air and make some wild arm gestures.

 

The only actual results from all that posturing was for chirac & "de villepin" to briefly enjoy some popularity in France, when their gaullist "third way" delusions of having France attaining the leadership of an "anti-US bloc" met and fuzioned with the leftist & MSM "pacifism"... and to have saddam think he may get away from this without having to pay the piper for defying the USA. This later bit didn't change much, saddam wouldn't have folded anyway, it just made the pre-war psychodrama drag on.

 

The defining image of this circus was and still is "de villepin" being applauded after his ambush UN speech... by a sea of third world delegates.... Just as the defining image of chirac's presidential mandates was his 2002 re-election night rallye, when he was being ovationed by a sea of arab Yoofs waving moroccan, algerian, tunisian flags,... in the heart of Paris.

Those two were much more dangerous ennemies of France, that they ever were of the USA. France was a sideshow (literally, chirac & co are freaks).

 

Incidentally, while the french opposition to the war went beyond any kind of friendly oppostion, to venture into full-blown hostility and backstabbing, I can assure you that the "response" from the US MSM & chattering class has been *devastating* for the public perception of the USA in France, and I'd say in Western Europe. 

 

There always has been a recurring anti-americanism feeling in France, from the communist left of course, but also from the "sovereignty" right (the gaullist dirtbags included), but this had the effect of making any kind of pro-US feeling go literally underground.

An incredible force multiplier for the anti-US players. Not very smart.