Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Leadership Discussion Board
Sign In   Return to Topic Page
Subject: Could Germany and the Axis powers have Won the Second World War?
Johnny Frost    1/16/2004 7:10:16 AM
The parameters for this debate are that the same countries were involved, and on the same sides. What can change is the sequence of operations, attacking Russia from south through Iraq/Iran etc. I have thought about this, and think that Germans probably could not take Britain, (I think they could have taken Russia to such an extent that they could dictate peace and or control the majority of the country such an extent to limit resistance) without destroying UK they would always have direct US/UK involvement in a mainland European battle. The best I think Germany could have achieved is stalemate in the west, with a long running air battle with UK/US. Whilst Germany diverted allot of resources to aiding Japan in fighting the US in the East. I don?t see how Germany and the other Axis powers could have won.
 
Quote    Reply

Email Me When A New Comment Is Made
Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest

Pages: PREV  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23
WWII thoughts    Could Germany and The AXis Powers have Won World War II   10/1/2009 12:24:16 AM
YES,
OF course they could have won
They could have won by invading Russiafirst  instead of Britain and then instead of splitting much of the german forces to capture stalingrad they should have focused on conquering the caucasus oilfields. Thus offsetting slightly or perhaps immensly a russian winter counteroffensive and at least preparing themselves for one. In the meantime they could have focused a major part of their army to capture the north african oilfields while britain was still reeling from the france invasion and dunkirk.then withe africa secure they could have then  prepared their invasion of Britain more accurately. With Britain conquered and the russians hopefully being stalemated in the east they could have then got ready for a US intervention because of British downfall. They could then negotiate with their allies in the East , Japan and support them with resources to attack and defend against an impossible American Navy and allied forces  and in turn to invade russia from the east. Thus Putting more pressure on the soviet war machine and keeping the Yanks bogged down in the pacific. They could also increase their territory strength against the russians and eventually the Americans as well. With Britain conquered many other European economies and nations would probably lose heart and turn to the aXIS (AKA gERMANY) thus increaing its resources and manpower to tackle the soviets in the east. Alternatively Once the soviets crumbled due to the combined German and Japanese forces In due time a peace aggreememnt could be forged between the russians (or not they could just conqueer it) and perhaps even the U.S  or a prolonged war in which it is uncertain who would win. Could be the germans. Yes, Germany could have won the war. 
 
Quote    Reply

LB    No   10/1/2009 6:35:34 AM
Germany could have won WWII only by ending the war with Great Britain.  Once they chose to go to war the USSR while still being at war with the British Empire they no longer could win.  Germany bled it's army out by the end of the first winter in the USSR.  They lost a million soldiers and never recovered.  They did not have enough men and units. Everything other explanation tends to miss this central point.  See John Ellis "Brute Force". 
 
Japan had zero chance of winning WWII.  The IJN would not tell the IJA they could never defeat the US so the war began based on the total fantasy that the US would sue of peace after Japan won a bunch of early cheap victories.  Japan had no military ability to impose it's will on the US and force a conclusion to the war while the reverse was not the case.
 
Quote    Reply

RedParadize       10/17/2009 1:29:36 AM
A very long series of unlikely event would have been needed to make the axis win... if you go for the most likely one it could look like this:
 
Germany is actively helping Franco Spanish Civil War. sending 50 000 "volunteer"
Result: Franco won in 1937 and is in the axis
 
Winter war happen before invasion of Poland
Result: French and British actively support Finland are at war with USSR
100,000 British and 35,000 French troops are send to help.
 
Invasion of Poland start in mars 1940, but instand of stopping at USSR border, they continue and rush to Moscow
Result: German only have 1 front,  and technically have France and great Britain on their side, even if they are at war. USSR is even less prepared then they where in 1941.
 
Germany, with most of its force deployed on the east. Hardly win the invasion of France. Helped by the Italian and the Spanish, Spain invade Gibraltar. and deny the access to Mediterranean Sea....
 
after that it can go smoothly, as long as Japan dont attack USA. I dont think Russian would have surender. So Great Britain invasion would have to wait until enought units are available.
 
Quote    Reply

The_Thing    Could the axis have won?   5/20/2011 11:32:30 AM

Anything is always possible. So i assume your question requests a more defined in-depth answer. Here is mine. Before and During the war, decisions were made (or not made) that determined the outcome of the war. So in order to change the out come (axis winning) anywhere from 1-all of the decisions that were made (or not made) must be altered in at least some way. It is not reasonable to say something like this: (...but if the weather would have been different...) because if history repeated itself, that same exact weather would occur in that area at that time again under control of nobody. It is reasonable to say (...if they would have launched that operation before that weather, or during, or after..ect..) which is a decision as stated above that would have to have been changed. Knowing this now we need to think of how many decisions, which ones, and how important were they. If you think about it, by changing the decisions made by the various troops, generals, and political figures of the war you can literally end up with almost an endless list of possible outcomes. I will not even try to state them all. Here are (inmy opinion) the most likely outcomes (where the axis wins)  and what "decisions" would have had to change in order for these to happen. I will divide these into Political, Economical/Technological, and Strategical subcategories.

     Politics- It is important to understand that the main reason hitler ordered less subs and more surface ships was to scare britian into submission, aswell as dunkirk to appease them and the half-hearted sub warfare to just scare them and not actually kill them is because hitler never wanted to conquer britian in his original plans. He enjoyed britian and its people, he viewed them as the only other pure, strong race. This also explains the lack of anphibious forces. Hitler tried very hard to get britian to either join him or back down. If this was not so, -if he would have planned the invasion as well as the rest of the invasion plans, britian would have fell. An underestimate of britians integrity and will caused the axis downfall. Britian ties down germany so they cant defeat soviets aswell as gives america an active platform for axis destruction.  

                 Others have stated this but i must rehiderate. Most of the soviet union, liked the soviet union less than the 3rd reich. If hitler wouldnt have been so oppressive and an evil fuck, he could have rallied the soviets agaisnt themselves, combined with germany's military dominance to that point, the soviets would have had internal wars/power struggles going on and a treaty would have been worked out just like in ww1. Instead hitler hated slavs and eastern europeans so he only excpeted a small limited army from the russian territories. If russia would have defeated itself due to germany, then germany could have focused on the west taking the mideast, and africa.

                 If the two decisions (by hitler) stated above would have been altered then despite whatever was going on in the paciffic, america would have had to settle with an agreement between them and germany at least.

                 Another thing i would like to mention is that roosevelts increasing strives to get into the war is what got us in , not exactly pearl harbor, (which by the way, we did know about before the attack hit) . But, if rossevelt "decided" not to rerun as president and somebody else took over who did not want to go to war, then the axis would have won for sure. I do not care what anybody says. Nobody was beating germany and certainly not japan without american help. And they wouldnt have lasted another 4 year election term eith

 
Quote    Reply
PREV  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23



StrategyWorld.com© 1998 - 2012StrategyWorld.com. All rights Reserved. StrategyWorld.com, StrategyPage.com, FYEO, For Your Eyes Only and Al Nofi's CIC are all trademarks of StrategyWorld.com Privacy Policy